Idling Vehicles

[dan j]

I've noticed a big increase on the amount of idling vehicles lately. People waiting in line at car washes when it takes several minutes before they have to move their vehicle again, people at work starting their cars via remote starters 10-15 minutes before they leave (and probably do the same before leaving for work), and all kinds of other useless idling like running into the store and other activities.

A few things about idling:

Typical vehicles do not need more than a minute or so of warming up.
It is actually bad for your engine.
Contributes to global warming.
Costs money.

http://idling.gc.ca

Lots of info there.

Also,

UN site for climate change

http://unfccc.int/2860.php

Please, don't idle your vehicles. It is a selfish practice that gives you very little satisfaction while costing everyone else on the planet.

[ceg]

I only start mine on really cold days because if not my car won't shift right and it's a fight to get it in or out of first gear.

[Clancy]

I dealership across from Superstone on Rothesay had cars idling at night with the lights on to draw attention to them. I kinda thought that was wrong.

[space]

I've noticed a big increase on the amount of idling vehicles lately. People waiting in line at car washes when it takes several minutes before they have to move their vehicle again, people at work starting their cars via remote starters 10-15 minutes before they leave (and probably do the same before leaving for work), and all kinds of other useless idling like running into the store and other activities.

A few things about idling:

Typical vehicles do not need more than a minute or so of warming up.
It is actually bad for your engine.
Contributes to global warming.
Costs money.

http://idling.gc.ca

Lots of info there.

Also,

UN site for climate change

http://unfccc.int/2860.php

Please, don't idle your vehicles. It is a selfish practice that gives you very little satisfaction while costing everyone else on the planet.

on a cold day new and old vehicle's needs at least 20 minutes to warm up. I would at least have my vehicle warm during this time of the year. if I happen to take a child to the hospital even if its a 2 month old!

[tag]

as far as I know, STARTING your car on a cold day, if it has not been plugged in, is hard on your car.... running it is not. The engine warms, the oil warms, the transmission fluid is not like molasses, etc, etc
and my tookus doesn't bounce off the seat when I hop in....lol

[Lemme_LQQK]

I've noticed a big increase on the amount of idling vehicles lately. People waiting in line at car washes when it takes several minutes before they have to move their vehicle again, people at work starting their cars via remote starters 10-15 minutes before they leave (and probably do the same before leaving for work), and all kinds of other useless idling like running into the store and other activities.

A few things about idling:

Typical vehicles do not need more than a minute or so of warming up.
It is actually bad for your engine.
Contributes to global warming.
Costs money.

http://idling.gc.ca

Lots of info there.

Also,

UN site for climate change

http://unfccc.int/2860.php

Please, don't idle your vehicles. It is a selfish practice that gives you very little satisfaction while costing everyone else on the planet.




Hahahaha, something else to complain about I see....too funny

[kb]

great now we are expected to worry about idling our engines and the exhaust causing global warming .HELLO look out east saint john see if you can see the sky or breathe ,again look in the west side same thing ,even if i let my car run for a day it wouldn't put out what the refinery or the mills put out in a minute. maybe you should be asking the owners of these places to shut down for a day and give our lungs a break.

[Dan_Man]

Your car idling might not produce a lot of green house gases but what if everybody lets their car idle?

great now we are expected to worry about idling our engines and the exhaust causing global warming .HELLO look out east saint john see if you can see the sky or breathe ,again look in the west side same thing ,even if i let my car run for a day it wouldn't put out what the refinery or the mills put out in a minute. maybe you should be asking the owners of these places to shut down for a day and give our lungs a break.

[wildberry]

I also have to warm my car up in the morning because if I don't it's very hard to shift. I also put my baby in the car , and lately it has been way to cold to put her in without warming the car up first.

[trinity]

I don't care about the car warming up inside, often I am all the way to work or the store before that happens noticeably, but I actually do time it and depending on the temperature and how long the car has been sitting undriven, I will let it run 2-6 minutes or else it hums and bounces and changing gears is clunky, and if it is fogged up inside I need time for the defroster to clear the windshield inside or else I could not drive. Of course, I do that only with my 97 ford, not my 2003 Saturn-with the Saturn I don't have to. Also, I wonder if those sites are generalizing for areas of North America that aren't -25 in the morning?

[dan j]

Also, I wonder if those sites are generalizing for areas of North America that aren't -25 in the morning?

umm, maybe you can visit them and see for yourself???

if you're not concerned about it, don't visit them. heck, don't even read this thread.

HELLO look out east saint john see if you can see the sky or breathe ,again look in the west side same thing ,even if i let my car run for a day it wouldn't put out what the refinery or the mills put out in a minute

yes, i'm aware that there are major corporate polluters out there. personally, i can't change that but i can control what i do as one person and so can you. if you read the numbers on the idling website the pollution each one of us creates each day added together is horrible. if no one is personally responsible for environment why would policy makers care to take it seriously? if you do a quick google there is lots more information out there for those who want to take a look.

Hahahaha, something else to complain about I see....too funny

what does this even mean?

i drive a 96 sunfire witih over 300,000 kms on it and it drives and shifts just fine after a nice 30/45 second warm up. most cars in good operating order do not need 10-15 minutes to warm up and maybe they are driving bad when they are first turned on because of the wear and tear put on them from useless idling or just regular wear and tear. about the young children, i don't have any so i don't know what temperatures and conditions children should be put in but i do know it would be nice to have a suitable world for mine to live in when i do have some.

[icedragon]

i'm not getting into a cold car. I wait 20 minutes for the car to warm up and then another 10 for the inside to warm up

[dan j]

i'm not getting into a cold car. I wait 20 minutes for the car to warm up and then another 10 for the inside to warm up

excellent.

[amethyst]

I let mine warm up long enough to defrost the windows if they need it. I'd LOOOOVE to let it warm up enough to Actually be warm to drive but i';m always late soooooo.......

I drive an automatic now...but when i drove a standard...omg...that puppy wouldn't shift right if it wasn't warmed up. It would just grind the gears.

[adm]

It's great to see the abundance of ignorance and the lack of respect and ownership that everyone is taking with this serious subject. Let's all teach our children how to not give a hoot too.........Cars and the fluids that run them are built for north american winters - take the time to read the informaiton provided in the link and quit it with the ignorance and lack of ownership.

dan_j is making a valid point.....it's not something to complain about, just something to think about.

[The_Dave]

You really only need to have the car running for 2 to 3 minutes to warm everything up in the engine. As for warming the entire car up, letting it sit for 20 to 30 minutes is just plain ridiculous. It is winter, dress for it. The inside of the car will warm up on your way to work or where ever you are going, which by the sounds of it, is the gas station.

[Tremc]

This is Saint John... a few idling cars won't make a difference in the amount of pollution already in the air.

[dan j]

*rolls eyes*

[The_Dave]

As people in the post have already said, every little bit YOU can do for the environment, helps the children of the future. Unless you just don't care about anyone's future!

[Dan_Man]

When will "certain" people finally realize that little changes in your everyday life can save our planet in the long run?
Little things like not letting your car idle for 20 minutes can help!

[marriedchickie]

I live about 5 mins away (by car) from my work, so I don't bother to let it idle before I GO to work, but after work, it seems that the ice is really bad on the windsheild (maybe because i work over night and that's when dew forms), so I just start it, scrap the ice off and off I go..I'm usually home in bed before the car gets warm enough.

[Mandi]

There are this many people in what someone has stated to be such a small city who think idling isn't a big deal. Imagine someone in a ig city having the same views. Our city air is polluted enough, why contribute to it and then complain about others who do ( I.e. Corporations) If you're not part of the solution in a small way, then you truely are part of the problem. Just imagine what could happen if you actually wore a winter jacket in the winter.... There is no reason to leave your car running for 30 minutes. 3-5 should be plenty

[dan j]

Thanks to those in this thread that "give a hoot" (remember that campaign?).

[trinity]

Indeed. I am so sorry to hear some of the comments here. About 15 years ago I took a course at UNB called Environmental Psychology. In it we learned that thinking is what needs to be changed, and that there needs to be a paradigm shift from wastefulness to conservation, and it is sad to see that nothing has changed in 15 years. For the people who warm their cars up to "make it better for your children", you are fooling yourselves, because in the end all you are doing is contributing to the pollution that will poison them in the end. Infants or no, they can take the cold too if they are properly dressed-what about the people who truck their kids all over town in strollers in the dead of winter?
What bothers me the most lately is seeing how many people in the obits are 20, 30, and 40 something. I have been reading obits since I was in my teens, I always liked a chance to catch some family tree info even then, and I see this more and more every week. While accidents happen, why are more people dying younger with heart disease and cancer? Could it be the increase in toxins we are putting in the environment? There are always the naysayers who think that one person can't make a difference, and if you believe that and don't change your wasteful behaviour, you're right. It's sad that people usually have to be legislated into doing the right thing.

[notfarnow]

You really only need to have the car running for 2 to 3 minutes to warm everything up in the engine. As for warming the entire car up, letting it sit for 20 to 30 minutes is just plain ridiculous. It is winter, dress for it.

Amen! Glad there are some people with common sense here.

I am amazed by the misinformation and ignorance in some of the posts here.



on a cold day new and old vehicle's needs at least 20 minutes to warm up.

That's because they're idling! An idling car takes WAY MORE time to warm up than a car that's being driven. Get in your car, let it idle for 20-30 seconds to get decent oil pressure, then DRIVE.


as far as I know, STARTING your car on a cold day, if it has not been plugged in, is hard on your car.... running it is not.

Yes, starting in the cold is hard on a car, and it is much easier on it if it's got a block heater plugged in. However, letting a car idle for a long time only makes things worse. It takes WAYY longer to reach it's optimal operating temperature (~90*C) so it runs much richer and pollutes WAY more. Also uses more gas.


This is Saint John... a few idling cars won't make a difference in the amount of pollution already in the air.

even if i let my car run for a day it wouldn't put out what the refinery or the mills put out in a minute. maybe you should be asking the owners of these places to shut down for a day and give our lungs a break.

Tremc & kb win the prize for the absolute silliest posts in this thread. They minimize the impact of idling cars, but complain about pollution from the refinery???!

It may not have ever been explained clearly to you, but the REFINERY makes GASOLINE AND DIESEL for PEOPLE WHO LET THEIR CARS IDLE UNTIL THEY ARE WARM.

LOL…. Classic! It’s like farting loudly in the elevator and saying it's your wife's fault for making chili last night. Even if your wife didn't make the chili, you'd still be a pig!

[tag]

while I do agree that 20-30 minutes is excessive, 5-10, depending on the car, is acceptable, IMO
I remember a time back in MB, that the temp never got above -40 for 10 days, THEN add the wind on it.
try warming up your car 1 minute in that! the tires are generally frozen to the ground from parking it warm

[notfarnow]

while I do agree that 20-30 minutes is excessive, 5-10, depending on the car, is acceptable, IMO


Not sure I understand.

In Your Opinion, it's acceptable to waste fuel and pollute the environment for 5-10 minutes for the sake of personal convenience? Is that what you're saying?

[dan j]

while I do agree that 20-30 minutes is excessive, 5-10, depending on the car, is acceptable, IMO
I remember a time back in MB, that the temp never got above -40 for 10 days, THEN add the wind on it.
try warming up your car 1 minute in that! the tires are generally frozen to the ground from parking it warm

"As an individual, you can be instrumental in reducing environmental impacts. If every driver of a light duty vehicle avoided idling by five minutes a day, collectively over the year, we would save 680 million litres of fuel, over 1.6 million tonnes of GHG emissions, and $646 million annually in fuel costs (assuming fuel costs are $0.95/L)." - from http://oee.nrcan.gc.ca/transportation/personal/idling.cfm?attr=0

these are Canadian stats. those are huge numbers for a country with only 30 million people.

[subaru2222]

Well the way I look at it is. Its their car if they want to start it and use their gas they paid for then go for it. I let mine run in the morning maybe 6 times a year. Sure each car running will pollute and of course it adds up. But we have to live too. The amount the vehicle would pollute in 10 min idling would add up but. If you drive 10KM slower on the highway that means your engine would rev less thus using less gas and producing less green house gas's. So should we all drive slower to save the earth? What about the people I see on the way to work waiting in the line blocking the road in both directions waiting for the drive through at Tim Hortons. They must wait for 5-10 min. Do they shut their car off? NO! if they parked in the parking lot and shut their car off they would pollute less and they would not be blocking the road. So they would kill 2 birds with one stone so to speak.

I mean this could get carried away. Drive slower save gas, check your tire pressure and save gas when its the proper pressure, where long pants and a sweater all the time at home and turn the heat down, cook 2 meals in the oven at the same time to save energy and zap it in the microwave the next day. How about car pooling? Almost every car I see coming from Quispamsis has only one person in it. Some people that live close by must head to the same area in town. Well this could go on and on. But I guess you cant please all the people all the time. If some people have nothing better to do then dream up things to tell other people that they are doing something wrong well thats life. I'm sure we all do things that if we changed something would improve.

For example they say fast food makes kids obese. Well if we all stopped eating fast food I mean everyone then all the fast food restaurants would close. Then kids would not get obese on fast food cause their would be none.

Or if everybody stopped drinking then #1 they would have more money. #2 there would never ever be another drunk driving death ever in the world again.

Or if everybody stopped smoking. The thousands and thousands of people that die from smoking related deaths would not happen. Sure they may die for another reason but not because of smoking.

I could go on and on but most of you probably stopped reading this along time ago and those who are still with me are the ones that will post and say I am full of something :) but thats fine. Maybe they just cant see the big picture and they get stuck on the small things that really mean nothing in the big picture of it all.

[Mandi]

Well the way I look at it is. Its their car if they want to start it and use their gas they paid for then go for it. I let mine run in the morning maybe 6 times a year. Sure each car running will pollute and of course it adds up. But we have to live too. The amount the vehicle would pollute in 10 min idling would add up but. If you drive 10KM slower on the highway that means your engine would rev less thus using less gas and producing less green house gas's. So should we all drive slower to save the earth? What about the people I see on the way to work waiting in the line blocking the road in both directions waiting for the drive through at Tim Hortons. They must wait for 5-10 min. Do they shut their car off? NO! if they parked in the parking lot and shut their car off they would pollute less and they would not be blocking the road. So they would kill 2 birds with one stone so to speak.

I mean this could get carried away. Drive slower save gas, check your tire pressure and save gas when its the proper pressure, where long pants and a sweater all the time at home and turn the heat down, cook 2 meals in the oven at the same time to save energy and zap it in the microwave the next day. How about car pooling? Almost every car I see coming from Quispamsis has only one person in it. Some people that live close by must head to the same area in town. Well this could go on and on. But I guess you cant please all the people all the time. If some people have nothing better to do then dream up things to tell other people that they are doing something wrong well thats life. I'm sure we all do things that if we changed something would improve.

For example they say fast food makes kids obese. Well if we all stopped eating fast food I mean everyone then all the fast food restaurants would close. Then kids would not get obese on fast food cause their would be none.

Or if everybody stopped drinking then #1 they would have more money. #2 there would never ever be another drunk driving death ever in the world again.

Or if everybody stopped smoking. The thousands and thousands of people that die from smoking related deaths would not happen. Sure they may die for another reason but not because of smoking.

I could go on and on but most of you probably stopped reading this along time ago and those who are still with me are the ones that will post and say I am full of something :) but thats fine. Maybe they just cant see the big picture and they get stuck on the small things that really mean nothing in the big picture of it all.

Yeah I read it all, and yes I'm posting. I just wanted to say wow to all the hypocracies in that post. Can't see the big picture? I think you may be confused.

[dan j]

People can do anything they want that they believe will help the environment whether it be not idling their car for useless reasons (we have to idle if we're in traffic but we don't have to idle waiting for the car wash or in the morning before work) or driving at optimal speeds/keeping your tire pressure at optimal levels. There are a lot of good ideas and some of them are so simple to accomplish - such as idling and car maintenance. No one is perfect but that isn't an excuse to leave responsibility to others and the planet behind.

You can look at it from a very extreme position and say that the vehicle owner can do what they want with their goods and it would be a good excuse but where are we going to draw the line between personal rights and collective rights? I'd say that running a car for no good reason infringes on the rights of others present and for those to come after us.

No one is going to force you to not run your car idle. Run it all you want but to sit here and argue against fact and logic is just silly especially with some of the circular and lazy arguments presented so far in this thread.

[The_Dave]

subaru, I see your points. I often think about how much fuel we waste and how much pollution we create waiting in drive throughs ONLY. We are a spoiled society, but that doesn't mean we have to ruin it for the children of the future. Every little bit helps. we could boycott the drive through at Tims and other fast food places, but that probably won't happen. Every one in their own way can help. Just try cutting back on one thing and see. I challenge everyone do do this.

[pamb]

wow where to start

i agree with dan j and everyone else who cares for our enviroment.cudos.blaming the refinery and the pulp mill save that for another from.getting back to the point of this form.letting your car run for 20-30 mins is alittle excessive i have a 5 speed and an automatic and we let them run for 3 mins max just enough to get the engine warm so it won't hurt it.and to clean it off.

IMO driving the car will make it warm up faster then letting it sit for 20-30 mins.and if its cold out dress for it.that's why they call it winter clothing.dress the part people.

[trinity]

I do understand running it longer some of the time-this winter I did have one day where no amount of scraping, wiping, etc would keep the window clear inside so I could see out to drive so I had to pull over again half a block down and idle it for another 5 minutes until the defroster actually warmed up and cleared the windshield inside. Heck, I even tried breathing into my scarf to try and not steam up the window but it didn't work. Is there anything you can do to stop that from happening?

[space]

is there any difference from idling ur vehicle and from driving ur vehicle? wouldn't it cause more pollution from your vehicle from having your foot on the gas peddle while driving? I could be wrong

[dan j]

space. it isn't an argument which one uses more gas.

say it takes 20 minutes to get to work and before that i run my car idle for 20 minutes. it isn't going to make my drive to work any shorter no matter how long i run my car before going. that first 20 minutes of idling is gas being used that i didn't need to use.

[pamb]

well said dan j

[space]

space. it isn't an argument which one uses more gas.

say it takes 20 minutes to get to work and before that i run my car idle for 20 minutes. it isn't going to make my drive to work any shorter no matter how long i run my car before going. that first 20 minutes of idling is gas being used that i didn't need to use.

I didn't say anything abot an argument.

from looking at the smoke stack at the refinery.. it seems that it's idling 24/7

here's a few that idle their vehicle's. fire trucks, ambulance, police, transit buses, school buses. why is this so much of an issue now.. is it because a second refinery coming? a second idling smoke stack.. I could be wrong.

[adm]

Indeed. I am so sorry to hear some of the comments here. About 15 years ago I took a course at UNB called Environmental Psychology.
God Bless the educated and informed. I'm dumbfounded by the narrow-minded opinionated folks who are commenting in this post! I hope these people are not teaching their kids by example.......I can see it now - "It's OK to be an ignorant polluter because there's an even bigger polluter that is helping feed 1/2 of the city that you live in". Because it's wrong and they are doing it doesn't mean that it's OK for us to not doing anything to help. Don't forget that they are all held accountable for everything that goes on in their plants, and they also have the clean-air coalition on their tails 7x24.

*sheesh*

[notfarnow]

Trinity:
As for windows fogging up on the inside, that is caused by moisture INSIDE your car. The best thing you can do is kick all the snow off your boots before you get in. Trust me on this... my suzuki has a wimpy little heater, and I get frost on all the windows if I let snow and slush melt in the car.

Another cause could be a leaky window, door or sunroof.

is there any difference from idling ur vehicle and from driving ur vehicle?

YES. When it's idling, your car takes WAAAAAY longer to warm up. Because it's running "cold" for so long, the engine runs "rich"... which means higher emmissions, more pollution, uses more fuel and decreases engine life.

The best thing you can do for your car is get in, let it idle for 30 seconds to get good oil pressure, then DRIVE. Simple as that. Letting your car idle for 10 minutes is NOT good for your car.

Subaru,
I understand your point (I don't think Mandi did), but I still think it's important to point out easy things we can do every day to make a difference.

[Mandi]

Subaru,
I understand your point (I don't think Mandi did), but I still think it's important to point out easy things we can do every day to make a difference.
I guess I didn't. :( Oh well.

[The_Dave]

Trinity, Or a faulty thermostat. This will limit the amount of heat given off by the heater/defroster. My windows are clear in mere minutes, but again I have a 2006.

[subaru2222]

Yeah I read it all, and yes I'm posting. I just wanted to say wow to all the hypocracies in that post. Can't see the big picture? I think you may be confused.

I may be confused? I don't think so cant get much more to the point then my post clean cut I would say. But maybe not for some I guess?

[Mandi]

I may be confused? I don't think so cant get much more to the point then my post clean cut I would say. But maybe not for some I guess?
I guess. it seemed sarcastic to me, maybe that's why I don't 'get' it. Like, it starts with car idling, and then people will be asking you to do the rest.

[Bawango]

I remember a few years back that they considered to pass a "No Idling" law. It may have been passed for all I know but not enforced like a lot of our local bi-laws. Anyway, I let my car idle for 10 to 20 seconds in the morning on when the temp outside is extremely cold. Today as it was a bit warmer so I started the car, waited 10 secs and drove.
PEI has a no idling bi-law and its enforced. If you go to downtown Charlottetown they have signs in front of parking spaces indicating that the maximum time that you are allowed to let your car idle is 60 seconds.
I just don't get why a small city like Charlottetown can enforce recycling laws and idling laws and our City cannot?! I Guess that the many things that wrong and backwards with this city.
Its sad to read that the attitude of a few here is that since its already polluted, who cares?! Letting my car idle for a few minutes is a not a big deal. What a sad attitude.
If a few people here that see whats been occurring around the world in regards to weather is "normal" it is not. If making a small effort like not letting your car idle is a big ordeal then we are in trouble. And my childrens future seems frightening. :confused::eek::mad:

[oldnugly]

millions of dinosaurs gave their lives so we could have fossil fuels.
is it not our responsibility to create global warming so they can come back?

i will be speaking at the flat earth society meeting fri at 9:00.

if you have to warm up the inside of your car get a small electric heater, it wont take long.

[Dan_Man]

[QUOTE=oldnugly;37909]millions of dinosaurs gave their lives so we could have fossil fuels.
is it not our responsibility to create global warming so they can come back?
QUOTE]


You have to be kidding me....

[adm]

Will you be serving donuts and lots of deep fried food at the flat earth society meeting?

[subaru2222]

With all the crap going on in the world. People starving and people in North America for the most part are obese and they throw away more food then you can believe. People getting killed in the war for no good reason. And we are worried if we ideal our car for 10 min once in a blue moon. Sorry I know people have to vent but next time pick a better topic.

And to the quote "millions of dinosaurs gave their lives so we could have fossil fuels."
the fossil fuels did not come just from animals its "Fossil fuel is a general term for buried combustible geologic deposits of organic materials, formed from decayed plants and animals" I would say more plant then animals.

[notfarnow]

With all the crap going on in the world. People starving and people in North America for the most part are obese and they throw away more food then you can believe. People getting killed in the war for no good reason. And we are worried if we ideal our car for 10 min once in a blue moon. Sorry I know people have to vent but next time pick a better topic.



I think it's a great topic. 30 years ago, peopel had the same attitude about littering... no big deal. People would toss their garbage out their car windows. It was too inconvenient to have garbage in your car.

Nowadays, it's completely unacceptable to litter. If you toss garbage out your window, people recognize you for what you are... an inconsiderate pig.

Same is true for people who let their cars idle till they are warm. In 10-15 years we will look back and say "wow, were THEY EVER PIGS".

[baseball 23]

I agree, this self-centered attitude that 'if i don't leave my car idling for 10 minutes it will be cold' will some day be seen as rude and do you really think it's helping the environment? No, then likely it's harming the environment and contributing to global warming. I first thought some of these people were joking about leaving their car idling for that long but i guess i was wrong. Come on people, we live in Canada, you won't die from the cold in your car if it takes 10 minutes to warm up while you drive to work, your kids won't die either, sorry, you didn't die when you where a kid and your kids won't either. Can't believe how selfish some people can be. If your that concerned about it, spend the money that your wasting on gas everytime you let it idle and buy seat warmers.

[space]

I don't think its that bad to idle your vehicle during the winter months compare whats coming out from the smoke stacks from the refinery 24/7
your not idling your vehicle all year round!

I could be wrong but another smoke stack coming SOON near you!

[Lemme_LQQK]

Yeah I read it all, and yes I'm posting. I just wanted to say wow to all the hypocracies in that post. Can't see the big picture? I think you may be confused.

I stayed with you and read this to the very end, and to that I say ^5.

And to DanJ, u asked "what does this even mean" in regards to my post.
Well I am guessing that u can read , it means just what it said , you obviously found something else to complain about.

[notfarnow]

I don't think its that bad to idle your vehicle during the winter months compare whats coming out from the smoke stacks from the refinery 24/7
your not idling your vehicle all year round!

I could be wrong but another smoke stack coming SOON near you!

Holy smokes Space,

Do you not realize how stunned that is? The refinery is making gas, for PEOPLE WHO WASTE FUEL.

If people did things to save fuel (like not idling), there probably wouldn't be a need for a second refinery. Idling your car is CONTRIBUTING to the refinery pollution.

[space]

oh i c just saint johners ain't allow to idle their vehicles because we have refineries.. lol I might be wrong

[adm]

oh i c just saint johners ain't allow to idle their vehicles because we have refineries.. lol I might be wrong

Nope - not wrong, just out to lunch......

[Dan_Man]

We're not refering to just Saint Johner's....

oh i c just saint johners ain't allow to idle their vehicles because we have refineries.. lol I might be wrong

[girdy]

With all the crap going on in the world. People starving and people in North America for the most part are obese and they throw away more food then you can believe. People getting killed in the war for no good reason. And we are worried if we ideal our car for 10 min once in a blue moon. Sorry I know people have to vent but next time pick a better topic.

I think this is a great topic, with all the crap going on in the world, we need the laughs from all the ridiculous things the people defending idling their cars for 30 minutes are saying.

[notfarnow]

oh i c just saint johners ain't allow to idle their vehicles because we have refineries.. lol I might be wrong

Space farts in the elevator, complains about the smell, and blames the company that made the beans he had for lunch.

[girdy]

Space farts in the elevator, complains about the smell, and blames the company that made the beans he had for lunch.

Oh, cut Space some slack, there is just too much Carbon Dioxide in his car from over idling it. His posts will improve once the weather warms up.

[space]

Space farts in the elevator, complains about the smell, and blames the company that made the beans he had for lunch.

oh somebody complaining wat I eat. my farts are pretty.. not polluted.. lol

[space]

Oh, cut Space some slack, there is just too much Carbon Dioxide in his car from over idling it. His posts will improve once the weather warms up.


I dont know what beans have to do with idling but how about we all
get together and have a big fart and see how much pollution it will cause ...LOL

[subaru2222]

I think this is a great topic, with all the crap going on in the world, we need the laughs from all the ridiculous things the people defending idling their cars for 30 minutes are saying.

Hey Girdy read all the posts. I do not let me car idle for 30 min. Read back I said I may idle mine 6 times a year for a few min when it is super cold out. the reason I do is if I don't my car will barely shift and in the super cold I cant see out the front window. I would rather idle my car for a few min then drive with frost on the inside of my window and not be able to see. I use to have to scrap the ice from the inside of my window and let it idle for a few min so I can see. So don't put words in my mouth like I idle for 30 min cause you don't know what your talking about. I don't even know why we are all still talking about this. The people that want to idle their car will still do it they will probably do it more now just to pee you all off. There are more important things to worry about then monkeys driving their cars.

[Dan_Man]

The future of our planet is pretty important to me...

[notfarnow]

Hey Subaru,

If you're getting frost on the INSIDE of your windows, you have too much moisture inside your car. In the winter, it's usually snow from boots. Knocking the snow off your boots before you get in makes a HUGE difference. This is especially true if you have kids getting in. Also, empty the slush & water from your floor mats.

You'll be really surpirsed what a difference it makes.

[girdy]

Hey Girdy read all the posts. I do not let me car idle for 30 min. Read back I said I may idle mine 6 times a year for a few min when it is super cold out. the reason I do is if I don't my car will barely shift and in the super cold I cant see out the front window. I would rather idle my car for a few min then drive with frost on the inside of my window and not be able to see. I use to have to scrap the ice from the inside of my window and let it idle for a few min so I can see. So don't put words in my mouth like I idle for 30 min cause you don't know what your talking about. I don't even know why we are all still talking about this. The people that want to idle their car will still do it they will probably do it more now just to pee you all off. There are more important things to worry about then monkeys driving their cars.

Sorry, you mis-understood my post. I was responding to your comment that this wasn't a very good topic, I was replying that it was a good topic because of all the laughs I'm getting from the ridiculous comments by the over-idlers. I definitely wasn't attempting to lump you in that group.

No offense intended.

[subaru2222]

Sorry, you mis-understood my post. I was responding to your comment that this wasn't a very good topic, I was replying that it was a good topic because of all the laughs I'm getting from the ridiculous comments by the over-idlers. I definitely wasn't attempting to lump you in that group.

No offense intended.

Ok thank you for the reply :)

[subaru2222]

Hey Subaru,

If you're getting frost on the INSIDE of your windows, you have too much moisture inside your car. In the winter, it's usually snow from boots. Knocking the snow off your boots before you get in makes a HUGE difference. This is especially true if you have kids getting in. Also, empty the slush & water from your floor mats.

You'll be really surpirsed what a difference it makes.

Thanks but the reason was my car was a Neon and they have frame less windows and it was old so the windows did not seal. Thats why it was always frosted up enough to have to scrap it:) But your idea is a good one.

[Bawango]

I don't think its that bad to idle your vehicle during the winter months compare whats coming out from the smoke stacks from the refinery 24/7
your not idling your vehicle all year round!

I could be wrong but another smoke stack coming SOON near you!

This is the attitude that what I am talking about. Since we have a refinery that pollutes, idling our car is not such a big deal!!
Consider this, Thing about the actual number of people that do own a vehicle that starts their car for 10 minutes or so to warm it up. I bet you that the amount of carbon monoxide combined that being produced by all these cars will give the refinery a run for its money. It's always easier to blame someone or something rather than admitting that there is a problem and we are contributing to it.

[blazethachronic]

I agree with most of the people here that idling your car for half an hour is bad and trying to push the blame onto the refinery to exuse that type of behavior but I will say that I do idle my car often. I have an auto car starter that quits after 5 mins so I let it idle for that amount of time while I'm in the house getting ready for work and my daughter ready for school. I love my car starter and it was actually one of the reasons why I bought my car. Its a great feature and honestly I'm glad GM decided to put them in their new cars because it saved me the hundred bucks I would've spent going out and buying one. But one thing I have to say is I don't agree with people calling others ignorant or whatever because they decide to let their car idle. Its their choice, if they want to let it run then so be it. Don't blast someone because they don't feel the same way you do about your topic of the day. They spent the money on the vehicle and the gas that goes into it so they have the right to do with it as they like. Again I do think running it too long is a little excessive but you think just because some nameless person on Isaintjohn says to stop it they will? Anyways thats my 2cents. Sorry to get a little off topic.

[rhiley_08j]

Let's fix it all together lets all stop driving our cars that way there we won't have to worry about the pollution caused by the cars. Also, all those that condemn others I just hope that they do everything humanly possible to try and save the planet, for example composting, only buying green products, and making their clothes, and growing their own food, because if you don't do all these things than in one way or another you are contributing to the pollution of the planet. That's my two cents, because if I have a choice between a warm car and a cold one, I'll take the warm one. BRRRRrrr!

[trinity]

Some people on here are rude, but often there are things that people either don't know or don't think about and if that is the case, then it is good to prod them a little bit. Do you think I LIKE lugging bags of recycling to the depot on the corner? Is it CONVENIENT? Do you think I WANT to sit around my house with a sweater, slippers, and a blanket just to watch TV? Even though I love big cars, do you think I would dream of driving one these days? No, no, no, and no. It would be so much easier to just throw recycling away at the curb like so many other people. It would be lovely to sit in my house toasty warm while the power meter clicked and the coal burned at Coleson Cove. I'd love to drive an old Parisienne or an Electra. it's not about money, I could well afford to crank the heat, drive a vintage car etc, but I think we all have a duty to work for the greater good, which does NOT involve idling cars for our own comfort. So no, it's no just about an individual's "choice: or "right to do what they want with their car". If you don't have the RIGHT to pollute someone's air space with cigarette smoke, why on earth do you think you have the right to do it with exhaust? And once again, if you don't believe that every little bit helps, then you are (a) going to do everything possible to ensure that you are Right and (b) part of the problem.

[dan j]

Let's fix it all together lets all stop driving our cars that way there we won't have to worry about the pollution caused by the cars. Also, all those that condemn others I just hope that they do everything humanly possible to try and save the planet, for example composting, only buying green products, and making their clothes, and growing their own food, because if you don't do all these things than in one way or another you are contributing to the pollution of the planet. That's my two cents, because if I have a choice between a warm car and a cold one, I'll take the warm one. BRRRRrrr!

Who made the rule that a person has to do everything humanly possible to help the planet? I do what I can and that involves owning a car that is good in gas, I don't idle, I don't speed, I bike to work several days of the week during the warm months, I compost, recycle, buy local food products when available, try to buy goods with as little packaging as possible, drink from a mug at work, use energy efficient light bulbs/washer/dryer/dishwasher, leave lights off as much as possible, keep the heat down, etc.. Do I think I'm perfect? No, of course not.

If you took the time to read this thread I said that people shouldn't use the excuse that they can't do everything to not do anything. I'd like to do more and will keep working on what I do. Others can do as they wish. No one really wants to condemn others but it can sometimes be hard not to when we see others being so selfish, short sighted, and then seem to be pretty comfortable and smug at their damaging behaviour.

So sure, maybe this thread seems like I am on a soap box but it is an important issue that only takes minimal effort from others to address. Maybe a few people will think twice before warming up that car in the morning. If not, well, I'll still keep my car off until I'm ready to drive it. I don't see the need to debate the topic. It's pretty cut and dry. It's a bad habit and damages the environment and if people choose to do it, they're being selfish. We don't really need to hear people excusing their behaviour. If people are comfortable with doing it, why do they defend themselves?

[beancounter82]

Drive thru's should be a thing of the past. But people line up daily! Even when gas was $1.25 people still did it!

Anyone ever see "Who killed the electric car?" Good movie. Makes you think.

[rhiley_08j]

Who made the rule that a person has to do everything humanly possible to help the planet? I do what I can and that involves owning a car that is good in gas, I don't idle, I don't speed, I bike to work several days of the week during the warm months, I compost, recycle, buy local food products when available, try to buy goods with as little packaging as possible, drink from a mug at work, use energy efficient light bulbs/washer/dryer/dishwasher, leave lights off as much as possible, keep the heat down, etc.. Do I think I'm perfect? No, of course not.

If you took the time to read this thread I said that people shouldn't use the excuse that they can't do everything to not do anything. I'd like to do more and will keep working on what I do. Others can do as they wish. No one really wants to condemn others but it can sometimes be hard not to when we see others being so selfish, short sighted, and then seem to be pretty comfortable and smug at their damaging behaviour.

So sure, maybe this thread seems like I am on a soap box but it is an important issue that only takes minimal effort from others to address. Maybe a few people will think twice before warming up that car in the morning. If not, well, I'll still keep my car off until I'm ready to drive it. I don't see the need to debate the topic. It's pretty cut and dry. It's a bad habit and damages the environment and if people choose to do it, they're being selfish. We don't really need to hear people excusing their behaviour. If people are comfortable with doing it, why do they defend themselves?


I am not saying that you are wrong in your views and in all honesty I wish that everyone in the whole world felt the same way that you do, but I have been forced to face reality. No matter how much you wish things will change, it's just not going to happen. I believe mankinds fate is already drawn out for them and we are following exactly to a tee what is destined to happen, so no matter how much I don't like the reality of the matter I know that I as one person can only do so much, and in the grander scheme of things it's not going to amount to a whole lot of beans. And I know that it's "attitudes like mine that will never change anything", and I realize this but if there is some way that you can make everyone care, please let me know and I will certainly jump on the bandwagon with you, until then, I will except what today's reality is, and try to make the best of what is available. No hostility or narrow-minded thought intended.

[Lemme_LQQK]

Ok I have read all replies and I have never read anything as silly as what I have been reading here.

C'mon now, if you start your vehicle and let it idle for however long u let it idle , you r obviously going to drive somewhere . So the question is this , what is the difference between letting your vehicle idle and driving it to where ever , be it a 10 min drive to an hours drive , somewhere in there you will be stopping at a stop sign AND lights , thus your car is "IDLING" , and as you proceed on your journey , your vehicle is still emitting exhaust .
So I say there is no difference whether you are stopped or moving.
you ( people in general) are still polluting. And as far as letting your vehicle idle for only 10 - 60 secs for goodness sakes it takes at least 5 - 10 secs just to turn the key and let go.....and another 10 secs to pull out a cigarette and light it, because you want both hands on the wheel when driving. ( had to add that for us smokers)

[dan j]

Ok I have read all replies and I have never read anything as silly as what I have been reading here.

C'mon now, if you start your vehicle and let it idle for however long u let it idle , you r obviously going to drive somewhere . So the question is this , what is the difference between letting your vehicle idle and driving it to where ever , be it a 10 min drive to an hours drive , somewhere in there you will be stopping at a stop sign AND lights , thus your car is "IDLING" , and as you proceed on your journey , your vehicle is still emitting exhaust .
So I say there is no difference whether you are stopped or moving.
you ( people in general) are still polluting. And as far as letting your vehicle idle for only 10 - 60 secs for goodness sakes it takes at least 5 - 10 secs just to turn the key and let go.....and another 10 secs to pull out a cigarette and light it, because you want both hands on the wheel when driving. ( had to add that for us smokers)

I'm going to assume you're not serious. It'll make the last few minutes of my morning go by a lot easier than think you actually put serious thought into that logic.

[Lemme_LQQK]

yep I did ...lol

[Lisa_morris]

I do not drive but I do have to say that I never realized that someone trying to let others know something is a bad thing. Why is it so wrong to try and reduce pollution. You dont have to do it, you didnt have to read it. So like mothers have always said, if you dont have anything nice to say dont say anything at all. And thanks for the advice when I do get a car, Ill try and do my part and not idle as long.

[Dan_Man]

Someone put their thinking hat on :)

Please read below:
http://www.cbc.ca/canada/new-brunswick/story/2007/02/20/nb-idlinginvention.html

[beancounter82]

Someone put their thinking hat on :)

Please read below:
http://www.cbc.ca/canada/new-brunswick/story/2007/02/20/nb-idlinginvention.html



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Link no worky

[notfarnow]

Wierd, this is what I got:

http://www.jakepalmeristheman.com/uploaded_images/ic-741946.JPG

[adm]

Tell me THAT doesn't put a knot in your stomach!! :-|

I just tried it and it works - it's an article about a new device for truck drivers so that they can keep their cabins warm without idling their trucks.....

Let us know if you need to be bailed out of the RCMP detention center! ;-)

[Dan_Man]

Wierd, this is what I got:

http://www.jakepalmeristheman.com/uploaded_images/ic-741946.JPG

hahahaha :P It was only a CBC article...

[Smash]

GULP!!! I'm scared to death to click on the link now!

[The_Dave]

Oh oh I hear the internet police at your door.

[trinity]

Not me, that just poses the challenge to try it. I could use a few days off work lol.

[dan j]

Town reduces vehicle idling

Article Tools
Print
CANDICE MAC LEAN
TELEGRAPH-JOURNAL
Published Wednesday February 28th, 2007
Appeared on page C6

Greenhouse gas emissions have wafted onto the public's radar recently, and because of the environmental threat, the town of Grand Bay-Westfield has decided to stand idle no more.

No engine in the fleet of vehicles used by town staff can be left idling unnecessarily.

"It's not good to idle a vehicle so it's in keeping with trying to make sure the vehicles are in top notch condition while protecting the environment at the same time," said the town's mayor, Grace Losier.

The anti-idling policy became effective in October, and is believed to be the first of its kind among Greater Saint John's municipalities.

Tim Vickers of the Atlantic Coastal Action Program (ACAP) in Saint John said Grand Bay-Westfield's initiative is the second idling policy he's heard of in the Saint John area. The other was put in place in October 2005 by the Department of Education, which declared that provincewide, the 1,200 school buses that operate daily could not let their engines idle.

According to a Natural Resources Canada website, if every Canadian driver of a light weight vehicle avoided idling five minutes a day over one year, 680 million litres of fuel would be saved, along with more than 1.6 million tonnes of greenhouse gas emissions.

In addition about $646 million would be saved in fuel costs.

But even given the statistics, a remote control vehicle starter is hard to pass up for some people on a cold day in Saint John, Vickers said.

Can one person make a difference?

"When you make it a social norm where you have 100,000 people in a given area doing it, or across the province, then mathematically you do see compounded effects," Vickers said. "If people take it upon themselves as a society, then yes, individuals added up can make a difference."

Saint John resident Dan Jones is an example of one of those individuals.

Jones, who says he never idles his vehicle for more than 10 seconds, cites Grand Bay-Westfield's policy is a step in the right direction, but said it's just the beginning in solving a large problem.

"The environment is ours to use but it's not ours to ruin for other people and also for future generations," Jones said.

"It's so simple, so easy to do "... something like recycling or composting involves actually doing something. To not idle actually involves not doing something."

Jones said he'd like to see Saint John's city council and local businesses adopt anti-idling policies to set an example for the community. After that, he said a bylaw should be set so people cannot idle their vehicles when it's not necessary.

The anti-idling website also dispels a myth that idling for long periods of time is an effective way to warm up a vehicle.

Parts of the vehicle can only be warmed up when the vehicle is moving, it says, adding that the best way to warm up a vehicle is to drive it.

The belief that turning off an engine and restarting it uses more fuel than idling is also untrue, the information states. Ten seconds of idling can actually use more fuel than restarting, it says.

"I think government certainly has to take a lead on this," Vickers said. "I would love to see Saint John adopt an anti-idling policy on its municipal fleet and lead by example and hopefully from there others will follow suit."

To learn more about idling, visit http://oee.nrcan.gc.ca/transportation/personal/idling.cfm. The website also provides businesses with free posters and graphics to download and display in offices.

[wildflower221]

I think they should get rid of all the cars,buses,trucks,airplane and any other types of transport and everyone can walk and stay healthy and not be obese and there ya go the world is saved :)