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View Full Version : Tasers..Yes or No ?


daneast
12-06-2006, 02:55 PM
:( New Brunswick's Chief Coroner Dianne Kelly has set a date for an inquest into the death of Kevin Geldart, 34, who died after Moncton police used a Taser gun on him in May 2005.

Should tasers be allowed, if yes..why?..if no...why?:cool:

hiph0p
12-06-2006, 03:16 PM
yes.............they should..
but only in life/death sitation something really serious
the cops think its fun to use them they tazered my friend over nothing
i think the cops find it funny they over use their power of being a cop...
but thats my opinion most cops are grimey

6sixstring6
12-06-2006, 03:19 PM
yes, they usually don't have the finality of a bullet. When police are confronted with violent or non conforming people they need another avenue rather than having to get physical every time. Who wants to go to work every day with the possibility of getting into a fight. Tasers help remove some of that probability.

hiphop.........i hope you never need police assistance, but i'm betting if you did you would be one of the biggest whiners, wanting them to make things right for you.

daneast
12-06-2006, 03:25 PM
But what about them becoming used when not needed? They are after all police, trained in handling suspects and that is part of thier job. I have seen 4 officers and one suspect and they still tase him? Isn't that kind of excessive...

6sixstring6
12-06-2006, 03:34 PM
Try being one of those police and try to subdue or handle some people who are hepped up on drugs or alcohol or even some people with mental handicapps who have a very high tolerance for pain and will keep resisting. It doesn't matter how many police there are, sometimes yopu need something other than brute force. Yes they are trained to handle these situations but if the taser will resolve the issue quicker, why not use it. If you are a law abiding person, you have nothing to worry about.

daneast
12-06-2006, 03:37 PM
There is a case pending right now that was caught on a guys cell phone vid cam..4 officers, one guy hauled outside(he was not resisting) tased 3 times, then brought back into the building...

hiph0p
12-06-2006, 03:41 PM
cops are idiots and thats it they act like they are the **** and better then everyone else and they can do what they want when they want its the way it is and its the way it will always be cops now a days are crooked!

kaj27
12-06-2006, 03:41 PM
Here is how I see it. You have someone being disruptive. In a world where various disease run like teenagers at the mall, Me personally wouldn't want to 'touch' the person. A Taser is a good way to keep yourself safe.


Maybe the 'chance' of death will stop people from resisting arrest. I'm all for em.

amethyst
12-06-2006, 03:42 PM
Excessive is the case going on in NY with the undercover cops spraying 3 guys in a car with 50 odd bullets. THAT"s Excessive.

As for the taser...i agree they need them. I'd rather be tasered than shot thank you.

trinity
12-06-2006, 03:43 PM
Anything that would allow the police to help stop criminals, I'm for it. I'm tired of worrying whenever I leave my house that I will come home to find it robbed.

daneast
12-06-2006, 04:00 PM
Since 2001 of more than 50 people in North America died after suffering Taser shocks.

Look at it this way, your son or daughter, or sister or brother, goes out for a few drinks...has one too many...steps outside and someone picks a fight..the cops show up and think he or she started it and, where they are drunk,..they get tased..as a result he/she dies...

6sixstring6
12-06-2006, 04:02 PM
hiphop, rather than just making a lot of noise, please provide us with some examples that you have personal knowledge of (not something you heard or made up) to sustantiate your ramblings.


dan, you cite 50 deaths out of how many thousands of taserings? If you are going to give statistics, you have to tell the whole story. And please don't come back with one death is one too many. I'll repeat, if you are not doing anything to be tasered for then you have nothing to worry about.

daneast
12-06-2006, 04:05 PM
most people who think ALL police are crooked are doing something illegal or have something to fear from them..

daneast
12-06-2006, 04:09 PM
I get your point but you miss mine. It is under investigation because they tased the suspect 3 or more times after he is on the ground with 3 police on top of him and handcuffed..once the danger is gone..why continue to tase him?

6sixstring6
12-06-2006, 04:10 PM
good point daneast.

kaj27
12-06-2006, 04:20 PM
Since 2001 of more than 50 people in North America died after suffering Taser shocks.

Look at it this way, your son or daughter, or sister or brother, goes out for a few drinks...has one too many...steps outside and someone picks a fight..the cops show up and think he or she started it and, where they are drunk,..they get tased..as a result he/she dies...

Replace picks a fight with gets in a car and drives. Kills themselves and someone else.


Are we going to make cars illegal?

daneast
12-06-2006, 04:43 PM
Ok, so using alcohol was not a great example, and I agree there is a time for a taser, my point is it seems police are using them with excessive force ...tasing people even after they are down and out...if there is a slight risk of a heart attack etc..if you are tased, how much does that risk increase if you get tased 3 or 4 times..? As far as I can see, once tased your body siezes up and you drop allowing the police to handcuff you etc...no need to keep pulling the trigger. And if they are so safe, why doesn't walmart sell them..you can but a car..even a rifle..but not a taser.

6sixstring6
12-06-2006, 04:56 PM
and walmart would sell them for what purpose?? a car you can legally drive, a rifle you can legally hunt with it. now a taser you can legally what with it??

try to find better analogys.

daneast
12-06-2006, 05:11 PM
:confused: How about defend yourself...ever hear of mace..how many lives could have been, and would be saved, if the victim had a 50,000 volt taser in their purse or pocket? Try to find better replies....:biggrin:
Anyway, I was not saying there is not a need for tasers..just questioning how and when they should be used. Just because someone is disorderly a cop cannot shoot him in the foot(non lethal) so why is it they can tase him multiple times?

Nail
12-06-2006, 05:35 PM
I agree with Daneast. Tasers should be used with due care and logic. For example, assess the perpetrator and use what force you think might be needed. Some people can be assessed as "fragile to tasers".

Everybody has to realize that cops are people too, and they could be hurt at any time on the job. A lot of the time, they ARE hurt during these confrontations...do you hear about it? no. Also, police are trained to use these tasers. They themselves are shocked with them. They know--or SHOULD know-- what it is like. They are also "shown" what pepperspray feels like.

hiph0p
12-06-2006, 05:56 PM
good save by saying most...but no i dont do anything illegal.. they are just idiots to me i called them once for help and they turned on me im not going to get into details this one cop cussed at me and everything and one cused infront of my 2 year old son!! so i dont call the cops for help anymore i bet if i was getting killed and called they would say it was my fault they are *******s to me seriously and i dont know why i've hvent been in trouble in my life

most people who think ALL police are crooked are doing something illegal or have something to fear from them..

daneast
12-06-2006, 06:09 PM
:( my apologies ...sorry you had a bad experience with the police but not ALL are that way, Ive dealt with some very nice ones...:rolleyes:

hiph0p
12-06-2006, 06:17 PM
yeah i've met ONE and its my moms friend
but about the tazer thing
im not surpized about how many ppl have died the cops probably get an enjoyment from it didnt you se the guy from boston? and his face was in a mask bcause it was so beaten by the cops? a black guy about a year ago or more he stabbed a woman and killed a cop and the cops said it was from him jumping out of a window but it wasnt they all kicked his ass no doubt! his face was sooo messed up it was sad i mean terrible what he did but there was probably 10 cops beating on him and... my moms husbandis from ontario in toronto a real bad part and yeah he wasnt the brightest kid but they wanted him to rat out people and he wouldnt so they made up an excuse to arrest him and took him to a field and beat the crap out of him until he ratted them out but he didnt do it and his face was so big andblack and blue his own mom didnt know who he was and he was only lke 18-19

so i dont trust cops from my experiences and people i know and i dont hang out wth people who break the law



and about my typo's sometimes my keys dont press lol

daneast
12-06-2006, 06:48 PM
What about the . and , keys? Maybe the odd capital letter to start a sentence...kind of runs on..hard to read...lol

hiph0p
12-06-2006, 06:51 PM
yeah i have long nails :| reallly long nails its hard to type and my key board sucks:(

The_Dave
12-06-2006, 06:56 PM
Tase away, Tase them all. Do whatever it takes to keep the peace and get home to your families at night. Thank You very much Saint John Police department. I would not do your job for all the money in the world. You folks are great.

care78
12-06-2006, 07:20 PM
i think that there are some good cops out there, genuinely concerned for the well being of others, but there are some cops that i have encountered that seem to be on a big power trip! i mean lets face it... cops are just people like anybody else so it is possible that in some instances them may overstep the boundaries a bit, it must be hard on them day in and day out dealing with drug addicts,abusers,drunks,and various other people of the criminal element, i think the city should invest a few more dollars in getting their officers into monthly (or more often, as needed) counselling, so that they can better learn to channel their anger and perhaps prevent unintentional deaths.
i guess taser guns are more appropriate than guns, as long as they are used properly. if someone dies from being tased then i would think that perhaps they tased 1 too many times or for too long.... 10,000 volts of electricty flying through anyone's body for a significant period of time would seriously harm someone or kill them im sure.

KRS
05-08-2008, 04:45 PM
tasers are dangerous

inuit
05-08-2008, 06:08 PM
I need to jump in. You know me. I think when the cops choose to use a taser, it should be given the same consideration as using a gun because they do not know the effect it will have on the person being tased.

I know the police need a way to disarm and defend themselves against ppl on drugs, booze or are mentally ill. But saying that, shoudn't hospital workers,(nurses,doctors) who face this daily too, also use the same argument. We wouldn't tolerate it from them then why the cops?
Bear in mind that as well as defending yourself,nurses and doctors are not allowed to harm the patient. It could take up to an hour to get an order for a seditative and then it must be administered. So not just the police face harm on a daily basis.

The police also have batons, pepperspray and other police to help if needed. Tasers should be the last resort. What really gets me is the repeated use of tasers on an individual. Once and at the most twice should be sufficient. After that I think there's an element of torture in it.

As someone said eariler, if my son was at a bar and became involved in a fight by no cause of his own or mistaken idenity or due to mental illness, I wouldn't want him tased. I'd sooner they shot him in the leg to stop him. If he was injured as a mistake or illness at least he would heal and the cops could say sorry. Less chance of death. Death is too final. Can't go back and say sorry.

kaj27
05-08-2008, 06:20 PM
Using a firearm is a last resort, not a Taser. It's just another tool in the shed. If used properly it can help more than hurt. More training and understanding is needed.

Ignorance is bliss too eh? The voltage of a Taser has no bearing on how much damage it does. It's all about current. Could be 1 Million volts as long as the current is small enough.

I'm for the use of Tasers IF used properly.

donteatrawpotatoes
05-08-2008, 06:38 PM
I think it should be only used as a last resort.

Nail
05-08-2008, 07:53 PM
I agree with The Dave, who posted his response in December 2006, ALMOST 1.5 Years ago! (Nice kicking of a dead horse btw). If someone with frail bones or hemophelia or whatever got hit with a baton and was wounded/killed everyone would be up in arms about the police and their batons..."Make them use pillows! Its more humane!" you'd all say. Element of torture - an incapacitating jolt for psychos - compared to shooting a person in the leg - a life altering potential mortal wound. Police point guns to Kill. Aimed at the chest to inflict maximum damage. That is why they are the last resort. If someone were to attack an officer, which is a crime, the officer makes a judgement call to protect his own life. Baton, spray, taser, or gun. I agree that present day police arent all qualified to wrestle and restraint all people with their hands, but they have the technology. Its called a taser and i think it works well.

christine chittick
05-09-2008, 01:33 PM
http://www.cbc.ca/canada/british-columbia/story/2008/05/08/bc-kamloops-man-taser.html

Do you think that this is a "last resort"? Pepperspray contaminating the hospital, please. And to taser a 82 year old man 3 times after having by- pass as he was laying in his hospital bed. Come on, if 2 or more men (who should be in shape to do police work IMO) cannot contain an 82 year old who basically confined to his hospital bed without having to taser 3 TIMES, something is definitely wrong.

inuit
05-09-2008, 06:21 PM
People, like it or not , tazers kill. Police are not capable of knowing who will die or not from use of tasers therefore they should not be used without absolutely knowing they will not kill. Since that technology (to know or not) does not yet exist, tasers should not be used except as a LAST resort. Last after guns, at least with guns, you know the effect.

How the devil do you think hospital staff deal with druggies,drunks or mental ill patients? I worked in an er. for 4 years. We got lots of crazys. We'd call a code white and 3 or 4 male nurses responded. Cops do the same.

It's real easy to sit there and say "oh well, they are criminals so who cares?" Easy to say unless it's your sick son or daughter or other loved one. Just ask the parents of the young man who was killed by taser in Moncton a couple of years ago.

nasoj007
05-10-2008, 02:12 PM
People, like it or not , tazers kill. Police are not capable of knowing who will die or not from use of tasers therefore they should not be used without absolutely knowing they will not kill. Since that technology (to know or not) does not yet exist, tasers should not be used except as a LAST resort. Last after guns, at least with guns, you know the effect.


Ummm last time i checked guns kill people almost 100% of the time where a taser kills like 1 time in 20000*. I agree the taser should not be the first thing the police reach for but it definitely shouldn't be the last. I can see it being after pepper spray and before the gun.
Everyone always focuses on the few bad cases out of the bunch. What about the thousands of family's who's loved ones are still alive today because the cop grabbed his taser instead of his gun. Yes there are plenty of cases where a taser shouldn't have been used just as there are plenty of cases that a gun shouldn't have been used either. The media latches on to the story of the 'poor knife wielding woman in a wheel chair' that gets tasered but the completely ignores any case that the taser was used properly and effectively, that's just not a good news story. People have to start thinking for themselves and stop believing what the news tells you to believe.
The bottom line is if the police were taught to use a taser properly and to respect it as the weapon it is(not a toy) then the taser is a nearly perfect solution in a not so perfect world.

P.S. As far as my gun statistic goes I went by the theory that if you shoot someone in the face or chest(as the police are trained to do) they usually die. See below for the taser statistics(this was the only sight that I found that would say the number of deaths vs the number of times used).

*"Even if every death in which the TASER device is even mentioned —was assumed to actually be the fault of the TASER device — then it would appear to be an amazingly safe weapon. Around 27 deaths out of about 550,000 estimated uses indicates that the theoretical death rate is about 1 in 20,000. But, even those few cases exaggerate the role of the TASER devices in any deaths."
from 'Why do certain anti-police groups blame TASER for injuries or death' by Mark W. Kroll, PhD, FACC, FHRS
http://www.taser.com/research/Science/Pages/TASERBlameForInjuries.aspx

Just my 2 cents.

inuit
05-10-2008, 06:54 PM
Naso, I see you chose to quote only my first paragraph. Nobody has addressed my second paragraph just as nobody addressed this point in a previous post.

If police point a gun at a suspect's face or chest and fire, chances are the person will die as a result. If a police officer points a taser at a suspect, they are not sure wheather the suspect will die or not. Chances are they will not die but there's always a possibility they will.

Dying over some infraction (may be a very simple one) seems awfully drastic in a country that won't even execute a child killer but will take a chance of killing a store thief.

And if you are wondering, yes one death by taser is one too many. We don't have the death penalty in this country and if we did it wouldn't be for drunkeness, fighting, resisting arrest or mental illness.

I wonder if you asked the loved ones of those 27 who died, if they thought it was an acceptable risk, what would their answer be.

inuit
05-10-2008, 07:42 PM
27 is an awful lot of people who would otherwise be on earth to be with their loved ones and their loved ones be with them. Look at all they are missing because this harmless weapon didn't work the way it was supposed to or the person didn't respond to the shock the way they should have. The infractions those people died for did not warrant the death penalty.

nasoj007
05-10-2008, 08:41 PM
I definitely understand and respect both of your points but I would like to clarify.

I don't agree with the police using tasers improperly (IE: on someone who is simply being disrespectful or belligerent but otherwise harmless). The is police brutality pure and simple. It's no different than the officer punched them in the face and the officer should be punished as such. The officers need to be trained and if necessary punished into respecting the taser as a weapon. Tasers should be used against a violent offender after pepper spray doesn't work and before they pull their gun. No tasering some lady that mouths off at you or some guy that's on the ground surrendering but some guy that lunges at you with a knife...taser away officer.

For this reason I didn't quote your second paragraph inuit. I don't expect a cop to shoot a drunk just because he's drunk and cranky but I also don't expect a cop to just stand there and take it when the same drunk comes at him with a knife. Some times backup can't get there quick enough and the officer has to make a split second decision. The drunk made a choice, broke the law and threatened an officer's life so he then has to except the consequences of his actions. I would expect the same from a hospital worker dealing with a drunk or a druggie if he's struggling or being rough use physical force to subdue him, if he grabs a scalpel and comes at you you have my permission to cave his head in with a bedpan. I'm just trying to say that sometimes the police have to use force to do their job whether it be physical force or a weapon and because of this some people do die. It's unfortunate but it does happen. The only way that it's going to stop is if the person who's going to commit a crime sits down and think 'Is this really worth it?' and then doesn't do it.

By the way since 1993 over 70 in-custody deaths* have involved the use of OC(pepper) spray during arrest efforts but you don't see that splashed across the headlines.

*http://www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/6416/smith-ok.html

omyindeed
05-10-2008, 08:50 PM
whoops

omyindeed
05-10-2008, 09:06 PM
.

And if you are wondering, yes one death by taser is one too many. We don't have the death penalty in this country and if we did it wouldn't be for drunkeness, fighting, resisting arrest or mental illness.
March 2005:
Four RCMP officers are ambushed and shot to death on a farm near Rochfort Bridge, Alta. They were investigating reports of stolen auto parts as well as a small marijuana grow operation.
July 2006:
Two RCMP officers, Const. Robin Cameron, 29, and Const. Marc Bourdages, 26, are shot July 7 after a car pursuit of a domestic violence suspect ended near Mildred, Sask.
October 2007:
Const. Christopher Worden was shot in Hay River, N.W.T., a small town about 500 kilometres south of Yellowknife. The 30-year-old officer was responding to a call from a house for assistance at 5 a.m. on Oct. 6 when he lost radio contact with police. Two backup officers were sent to the scene and found Const. Worden in a wooded area suffering from gunshot wounds. He died in hospital.
November 2007:
Const. Douglas Scott, 20, was shot and killed on Nov. 5 in the Baffin Island hamlet of Kimmirut, about 120 kilometres south of Iqaluit. Scott, from Brockville, Ont., was responding to a complaint of an impaired driver late in the evening.
Looks like a death penalty to me......

I wonder if you asked the loved ones of those 27 who died, if they thought it was an acceptable risk, what would their answer be.

I also wonder what the families of these officers would say as well?
I say Tase em..

sarahnb
05-10-2008, 10:40 PM
My brother is an RCMP. I'm sure he'd rather take the risk with a Taser than a gun. I say if you are conducting yourself accordingly, you should be safe.

oasis
05-10-2008, 10:55 PM
Since 2001 of more than 50 people in North America died after suffering Taser shocks.

Look at it this way, your son or daughter, or sister or brother, goes out for a few drinks...has one too many...steps outside and someone picks a fight..the cops show up and think he or she started it and, where they are drunk,..they get tased..as a result he/she dies...


There are people right here is Saint John that will tell you that they are glad the cops used the taser. There was a woman who takes meds for I think it was for schizophrenia, who had stopped taking them. She was in the emerg at St. Joes and went nuts. She attempted to attack the ambulance attendants with a knife. The police showed up and she tried to attack them. The cop was in his right to use deadly force, but instead chose to use the taser.

End result. They subdued the woman, got her back on her meds and she is alive. She even thanked the cops that did it. Had that officer used his gun, she would have been dead. The article was in the Telegraph Journal some time ago, but I could not find it when I looked.

Are there cops that go for the taser to fast? I think yes. There should be better guide lines as to when it's acceptable to use them.

Back to your question. If they are getting violent. YES. Why should a cop risk his life trying to subdue your kid because he got drunk and decided to cause trouble.

Another way to look at it, Your husbands/Son/Daughter is a cop. She/he goes to work and gets killed by a kid that got drunk and violent. Who's life is more important? Depends on what end your at. But that cop should not have to die because his hands where tied as to what he was allowed to do to protect himself. If he uses the gun the person is probably 98% more likely to die.

If a cop uses excessive force. He is subject to the same charges as you or I if we got into a fight and one of us dies.

I have heard people say "Just shoot him in the foot/leg". These people have never used a gun. A gun (especially a hand gun) deploys a lot of force from it's muzzle. This causes the barrel to lift. You fire that gun in a hurry, and it will move. Your leg is only a few inches wide. At just 10 or 20 yards a movement of 1/2 an inch can mean the shot could be off by feet by the time it reaches it's target. That bullet has to go some where. It will ricochet of of just about anything. Once it does no one knows where it will stop, or who it will stop in.

People have been shot that where blocks away from where a shot was fired because of this. Luckily it is very very rare for this to happen.

inuit
05-11-2008, 07:31 AM
My brother is a R.C.M.P officer as well my neice and my nephew is at the Regina training center as I write. I worry about them at times. So yes I do look at tasers from both sides.

Yes, the lady you spoke of at St. Joe's was indeed saved but we would be reading a different story if she had died. Just to make a point tasers have benn used for only the past 5 years but violent , drunk and insane people have been around forever. In this case the cops would not have shot her in the E.R. I.ve seen them use a extendable baton that wacks the person on the wrist almost too quickly for them to see.

After working in an emergency room for 4 years and being a nurse for 19 years, let me tell you there are many many ways to subdue people without tasers. What have the cops been using in the past. They weren't shooting everybody before the invention of tasers.

If a person dies as a result of taser use, then I believe the cop who fired it should be charged with manslaughter. If there is a ppossibility of someone dying, it shouldn't be used.

I haven't heard of any cops dying as a result of 3 or 4 cops wrestling 1 drunk to the ground but I have heard of people dying as a result of an encounter with 3 or 4 cops.

If tasers are so safe, maybe we should give them to E.R. staff. They deal with more crazies than cops do on a daily basis.

donteatrawpotatoes
05-11-2008, 08:41 AM
My baby brother is now a Military Police Officer. Obviously I can look at it from both sides. When I say tasers should be used as a last option, I mean, for God's sake, don't taser people just for the fun of it. Most police officers are good people who choose their occupation because they care deeply about the people of their country/world, but there are some who do so they can abuse their authority.
I've seen cases where tasers were completely unnecessary. Why would anyone choose to taser someone just because they can? They risk killing them, so you'd think it would be a last line of defense. Can't get an old guy out of a bed? really. If you're not capable of doing that with three men, you should reconsider your job choice.


End result. They subdued the woman, got her back on her meds and she is alive. She even thanked the cops that did it. Had that officer used his gun, she would have been dead. The article was in the Telegraph Journal some time ago, but I could not find it when I looked.

Are there cops that go for the taser to fast? I think yes. There should be better guide lines as to when it's acceptable to use them.



That seems like a good instance to me to use it. But if a non violent person is just not doing things fast enough, I don't think they should be tasered because you're having a bad day.

inuit
05-11-2008, 11:05 AM
Well said Donteatraw. Here here.

rhiley_08j
05-11-2008, 11:22 AM
I could be wrong but I was always under the impression that when the cops do use force such as a gun, they are supposed to aim at an area of the culprit that will incapacitate a person, not necessarily kill them????

livkat
05-11-2008, 11:34 AM
I have heard people say "Just shoot him in the foot/leg". These people have never used a gun. A gun (especially a hand gun) deploys a lot of force from it's muzzle. This causes the barrel to lift. You fire that gun in a hurry, and it will move. Your leg is only a few inches wide. At just 10 or 20 yards a movement of 1/2 an inch can mean the shot could be off by feet by the time it reaches it's target. That bullet has to go some where. It will ricochet of of just about anything. Once it does no one knows where it will stop, or who it will stop in.
Like oasis said, you can aim, but you don't know where the bullet may end up.

inuit
05-11-2008, 11:44 AM
Yes Livkat, you are right. I have never fired a handgun and I had not considered how they fire.
I still stand by my views on use of tasers.

The police have several tools in their arsenal to use against uncooperative people. Tasers should be the absolute last resoet next to guns. They have always been reluctant to use guns except to protect life, theirs or others.
Maybe they should place the same gravidity on tasers.

I stand by nobody should have to die because they were stupid or non-compliant. Not punishable by death yet.

kaj27
05-11-2008, 11:52 AM
I could be wrong but I was always under the impression that when the cops do use force such as a gun, they are supposed to aim at an area of the culprit that will incapacitate a person, not necessarily kill them????

A gun? You mean a firearm?

rhiley_08j
05-11-2008, 08:42 PM
A gun? You mean a firearm?


Same difference...

kaj27
05-11-2008, 08:47 PM
Same difference...

A taser could be considered a gun, probably is.

rhiley_08j
05-11-2008, 09:35 PM
A taser could be considered a gun, probably is.


It's like a gun, but not exactly the same thing.


Ta·ser http://cache.lexico.com/dictionary/graphics/luna/thinsp.png <TABLE class=luna-Ent minmax_bound="true"><TBODY minmax_bound="true"><TR minmax_bound="true"><TD vAlign=top minmax_bound="true">a small gunlike device that fires electric darts to incapacitate a person temporarily. </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

kaj27
05-11-2008, 09:43 PM
I understand.

But the term gun is never used in the professional setting. It's either a weapon or firearm.

rhiley_08j
05-11-2008, 10:59 PM
Good to know if I ever decided to take up law enforcement as a profession. Thanks for the info.

gt
05-12-2008, 01:03 AM
i dont think they should be allowed to use tasers, most cops in sj or anywere at that are crooked as can be they think because they represent the law they are above it, tasers just give the police a supposably non leathal weapon they can abused at there will because no judge wll take the word of one of us over them and they know it, i cant speek for every cop because i believe there are decent by the book cops, but for most that is not the case, i worked at a local reteraunt in sj uptown, and a cop had a pat-time job there, i couldnt beleive the things he says he done in the dirty cop manner, and he brags about it and states his other cop buddies feel the same

~Butterfly~
05-12-2008, 02:52 AM
cops are idiots and thats it they act like they are the **** and better then everyone else and they can do what they want when they want its the way it is and its the way it will always be cops now a days are crooked!

I started to read this thread until I came to the post quoted above, then I decided to stop reading and move on to the next topic. I can't be bothered wasting my time on such a juvenile delinquent thing to say....

OK OK, without reading any further than the above quoted blabber, I have to say this and I will go away.... I have dealt with the SJPD on many occasions in the past 6 months due to an on going issue with some very VERY unruly neighbors. I can tell you from experience that each and every officer I dealt with was very professional, friendly and down to earth. They state the facts and nothing else (and for anyone to say they don't, well that's just BS) They treat you like a human being. And most of all they PROTECT us and our families to the best of their abilities.

No offense to the person who wrote the above quote but....typically when i hear someone commenting like that about law enforcement they are usually one of the following types of people....

1. Someone who has something to hide from police (ie.drug activity of some sort)
2. A trouble maker (like my unruly neighbors)
3. A child* who does not know any better and only repeats what his parents say around him (see 1 and 2)

Number 3 can usually be determined by the words used to make such comments, ie..., "cops are idiots and thats it" or by the sentence structure ie...well let's use the above quote again to demonstrate. once again no offense is meant to the original poster of said quote.

*child - 1. a person between birth and full growth
2. a childish person
3. a son or daughter
4.a person regarded as conditioned or marked by a given circumstance, situation, etc.: a child of poverty; a child of famine.

There, that's it I'm done :o))

P.S. I think police should be allowed to use tasers, but should have workshops periodically to ensure they are choosing to use them when properly called for. If I was walking down the street drunk for example and was causing a ruckus and being unruly and unpredictable i would appreciate a shot of electricity over a bullet any day...

oasis
05-12-2008, 09:00 AM
That seems like a good instance to me to use it. But if a non violent person is just not doing things fast enough, I don't think they should be tasered because you're having a bad day.



Absolutely correct. I stated in my last post that there should be CLEAR guide lines as to when they can be used. Any officer that uses it just because the person they were dealing with is a little slow to respond or is questioning the officer should be charged.

There was a video on youtube that showed a cop tasering a fellow because he refused to sign a ticket. The guy was no threat. He did not see a reduce speed sign that the cop had blocked with his car. The cop pulled him over and gave him a ticket. The guy wanted to go back and see this sign. If it was there alright he wouldn't argue the ticket. The officer just didn't want to be bothered. So he used excessive force to control him.

inuit
05-12-2008, 10:15 AM
I was watching canada am and I see where there is an inquiry on taser use following the death of that fellow in the airport in Vancouver? . Hopefully that will curtail the flagrant use of tasers. The former solicitor general will testify later today that he was misled on reports of taser safety. Or so that's what I understand the news report to say. the news went on to say that when they test the taser, it's on healthy police volunteers and they are hit once in the back. When police shoot suspects , it's several times in the chest. People are dying as a result of ventricular fibulation caused by the electrical interruption of the heart.The heart is an electrical organ.Runs on electrical impulses.

Did you see where in the state of Ohio, the coroner's office is not allowed to use the word "taser" in their post mortem reports. Talk about too much power.

Have you ever watched COPS. on Saturday night? Holy Moses, they use their tasers like they were using silly string.Scary!

rhiley_08j
05-12-2008, 06:15 PM
I started to read this thread until I came to the post quoted above, then I decided to stop reading and move on to the next topic. I can't be bothered wasting my time on such a juvenile delinquent thing to say....

OK OK, without reading any further than the above quoted blabber, I have to say this and I will go away.... I have dealt with the SJPD on many occasions in the past 6 months due to an on going issue with some very VERY unruly neighbors. I can tell you from experience that each and every officer I dealt with was very professional, friendly and down to earth. They state the facts and nothing else (and for anyone to say they don't, well that's just BS) They treat you like a human being. And most of all they PROTECT us and our families to the best of their abilities.

No offense to the person who wrote the above quote but....typically when i hear someone commenting like that about law enforcement they are usually one of the following types of people....

1. Someone who has something to hide from police (ie.drug activity of some sort)
2. A trouble maker (like my unruly neighbors)
3. A child* who does not know any better and only repeats what his parents say around him (see 1 and 2)

Number 3 can usually be determined by the words used to make such comments, ie..., "cops are idiots and thats it" or by the sentence structure ie...well let's use the above quote again to demonstrate. once again no offense is meant to the original poster of said quote.

*child - 1. a person between birth and full growth
2. a childish person
3. a son or daughter
4.a person regarded as conditioned or marked by a given circumstance, situation, etc.: a child of poverty; a child of famine.

There, that's it I'm done :o))

P.S. I think police should be allowed to use tasers, but should have workshops periodically to ensure they are choosing to use them when properly called for. If I was walking down the street drunk for example and was causing a ruckus and being unruly and unpredictable i would appreciate a shot of electricity over a bullet any day...


You have to realize that perhaps you don't know every circumstance that a person might go through with a law enforcement officer. I am not saying that I agree that all "cops are idiots", but to assume that all are professional and do not abuse their power is absurd. I know for a fact several circumstances where law enforcement officers have abused their power, which has resulted in unnecessary injury or even death. It does happen, and to pull the wool over your eyes and only see what you see right in front of you is a very narrow perspective.

donteatrawpotatoes
05-12-2008, 07:02 PM
Absolutely correct. I stated in my last post that there should be CLEAR guide lines as to when they can be used. Any officer that uses it just because the person they were dealing with is a little slow to respond or is questioning the officer should be charged.

There was a video on youtube that showed a cop tasering a fellow because he refused to sign a ticket. The guy was no threat. He did not see a reduce speed sign that the cop had blocked with his car. The cop pulled him over and gave him a ticket. The guy wanted to go back and see this sign. If it was there alright he wouldn't argue the ticket. The officer just didn't want to be bothered. So he used excessive force to control him.


I saw that too.. appalling. 'This guy took a ride down the taser highway' and you should be taking a ride down the police brutality one all the way to court buddy... in front of his wife and kids no less! just disgusting.

gt
05-12-2008, 09:54 PM
i think we should go UK on the police and only allow billy sticks, if this stuff keeps up the police are going to end up them 3 crooked cops who put 50 bullets into sean bell and 2 hours before he got married, we gotta put a stop to police brutallity

inuit
05-13-2008, 12:34 AM
Cops are people too, some bad some good. In my years in the Er., I've met many cops. Most were very professional and nice but there were a few who I thought were real egomaniacs and so full of themselves. The exact same as any other profession out there. Absolute power corrupts absolutely. Who's policing the police?

Tremc
05-14-2008, 05:54 PM
People don't die from being hit with a Taser. They die from a condition known as "Excited Delirium." Anyone can suffer experience ED in a panicked state of mind. I wrote about Excited Delirium in the past on this site in another Taser discussion.

I'm not going to explain excited delirium or how it affects a person. Do some research and lets leave the police officers and how they conduct their work alone. Hopefully excited delirium ends this discussion.

orange
05-14-2008, 06:10 PM
People don't die from being hit with a Taser. They die from a condition known as "Excited Delirium." Anyone can suffer experience ED in a panicked state of mind. I wrote about Excited Delirium in the past on this site in another Taser discussion.

I'm not going to explain excited delirium or how it affects a person. Do some research and lets leave the police officers and how they conduct their work alone. Hopefully excited delirium ends this discussion.

"Excited delirium" is a bunch of hogwash. Just yesterday, there was this article:
http://www.thestar.com/News/Canada/article/425113

The real problem is when police officers are careless or reckless in their use of tasers. There are countless examples of it.

And personally, I've seen some cops whose intelligence level I really have to question (and no, I've never been arrested for anything, or even been pulled over). As an example, we can look at the morons who responded to the incident at the Vancouver airport a few months ago and tasered a man to death.

That said, I realize that most police officers are excellent citizens, that they do very important jobs, and that they have to deal with scum constantly. Still though, one would have to be in denial to not believe that some police officers are corrupt and/or abuse their power. And in other cases, they may simply lack adequate training.

Tasers are useful, but I think each police officer should have to go through a mandatory in-depth training course before being allowed to carry a taser.

inuit
05-14-2008, 07:01 PM
Yes Tremc, people do die from ED state if hit by taser. That is not the only reason people die though when hit by taser fire. The jolt from the taser fired onto the chest can cause ventriculler fibulation. That's when the ventricles of the heart beat really fast and is ineffective as a pump. If the heart is not defibulated quickly it will stop pumping altogether.

When I watch police taser people on t.v. news or whatever, they make no effort to check for injury. I've seen the suspect on the ground moaning in pain and the cops more intent on getting him on his stomach and handcuffed than being concerned that the suspect is actually hurt or in mortal danger. Way too callous. We are talking about human life here.

People need not die for stupidity at the hands of police. If an officer is in mortal danger of his life then maybe taser but not for non-compliance.

Again tonight on the news, I see where the taser is being given some real investigation. Maybe this will be an end to it.

inuit
05-14-2008, 07:18 PM
I'd like to add that nurses, doctors, police officers ,mental health workers and some advanced ambulance people are trained in talking to and calming agitated people. This has been taught for decades and used fairly effectivly up until the taser. Now it's just easier to tase first and talk second.

kaj27
05-14-2008, 07:25 PM
I'd like to add that nurses, doctors, police officers ,mental health workers and some advanced ambulance people are trained in talking to and calming agitated people. This has been taught for decades and used fairly effectivly up until the taser. Now it's just easier to tase first and talk second.

Odd, my girlfriend was never trained. She's an RN.

They do nothing more than call security or the police. :)

oasis
05-14-2008, 09:03 PM
People don't die from being hit with a Taser. They die from a condition known as "Excited Delirium." Anyone can suffer experience ED in a panicked state of mind. I wrote about Excited Delirium in the past on this site in another Taser discussion.

I'm not going to explain excited delirium or how it affects a person. Do some research and lets leave the police officers and how they conduct their work alone. Hopefully excited delirium ends this discussion.

This thread has never been about the cause of death, only the fact that people die and the morality of it. You can write about Excited Delirium all you want. That will not put an end to the thread. Some people are just against the use of tasers. They couldn't care less what caused the death, just the fact some one died.

Maybe if you gave us some back ground about yourself and your knowledge on the subject it might make a difference, though I doubt it.

inuit
05-14-2008, 10:57 PM
.....

wookiee
05-15-2008, 12:42 PM
People don't die from being hit with a Taser. They die from a condition known as "Excited Delirium." Anyone can suffer experience ED in a panicked state of mind. I wrote about Excited Delirium in the past on this site in another Taser discussion.

I'm not going to explain excited delirium or how it affects a person. Do some research and lets leave the police officers and how they conduct their work alone. Hopefully excited delirium ends this discussion.





What would you do if you saw a loved on getting tasered and died an hr or two later....would you blame that on "Excited Delirium"....

I think not!

KRS
05-15-2008, 03:00 PM
Dont Tase Me Bro

donteatrawpotatoes
05-15-2008, 03:01 PM
Dont Tase Me Bro

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh33/Emoticon_Valley/funny%20pictures/dont-tase-me-bro-4.jpg

lawl

christine chittick
05-15-2008, 04:51 PM
I think I have a case of "excited delirium" now...

sanstu
05-15-2008, 07:15 PM
I really want a taser!