What Have we Done? Or allowed them to do?

[Pumpkin]

I received this in an email this morning, some may recognize it already. I thought it worthy for a read and thought I would post it. Normally I dont post this kind of stuff but it makes ALOT of sense!! Please read to the end!!

WOW, WHAT A WAKEUP

Dear God:
Why didn't you save the school children at ....
Blackburg, Virginia
Amish Country, PA
Cazenovia, Wisconsin
Columbine High School
Moses Lake, Washington 2/2/96
Bethel, Alaska 2/19/97
Pearl, Mississippi 10/1/97
West Paducah, Kentucky 12/1/97
Stamp, Arkansas 12/15/97
Jonesboro, Arkansas 3/24/98
Edinboro, Pennsylvania 4/24/98
Fayetteville, Tennessee 5/19/98
Springfield, Oregon 5/21/98
Richmond, Virginia 6/15/98
Littleton, Colorado 4/20/99
Taber, Alberta, Canada 5/28/99
Conyers, Georgia 5/20/99
Deming, New Mexico 11/19/99
Fort Gibson, Oklahoma 12/6/99
Santee, California 3/ 5/01 and
El Cajon, California 3/22/01?
Sincerely,
Concerned Student

-----------------------------------------------------

Reply:
Dear Concerned Student:
I am not allowed in schools.
Sincerely,
God

----------------------------------------------------------

How did this get started?...
-----------------
Let's see,
I think it started when Madeline Murray O'Hare
complained
She didn't want any prayer in our schools.
And we said, OK..
------------------
Then ,
Someone said you better not read the Bible in
school,
The Bible that says
"thou shalt! Not kill,
Thou shalt not steal,
And love your neighbors as yourself,"
And we said, OK...
-----------------
Dr. Benjamin Spock said
We shouldn't spank our children
When they misbehaved
Because their little personalities
Would be warped and we might damage their
self-esteem.
And we said,
An expert should know what he's talking about
So we won't spank them anymore..
------------------
Then someone said
Teachers and principals better not
Discipline our children when they misbehave.
And the school administrators said
No faculty member in this school
Better touch a student when they misbehave
Because we don't want any bad publicity,
And we surely don't want to be sued.
And we accepted their
reasoning...
------------------
Then someone said
let's let our daughters have abortions if they
want,
And they won't even have to tell their parents.
And we said, that's a grand idea...
------------------
Then some wise school board member said,
Since boys will be boys
And they're going to do it anyway,
let's give our sons all the condoms they want,
So they can have all the fun they desire,
And we won't have to tell their parents they got
them at school.
And we said, that's another great idea...
------------------
Then some of our top elected officials said
It doesn't matter what we do in private as long as
we do our jobs.
And we said,
It doesn't matter what anybody,
Including the President,
Does in private as long as we have jobs and the
economy is good....
------------------
And someone else took that appreciation a step
further
And published pictures of nude children
And then stepped further still by
Making them available on the
Internet.
And we said, everyone's entitled to free speech....
------------------
And the entertainment industry said,
let's make TV shows and movies that promote
Profanity, violence and illicit sex...
And let's record music that encourages
Rape, drugs, murder, suicide, and satanic themes...
And we said,
it's just entertainment
And it has no adverse effect
And nobody takes it seriously anyway,
So go right ahead.
------------------
Now we're asking ourselves
Why our children have no conscience,
! And why it doesn't bother them to
Kill strangers, classmates or even themselves.
------------------
Undoubtedly,
If we thought about it long and hard enough,
We could figure it out.
I'm sure it has a great deal to do with...
"WE REAP WHAT WE SOW,"
------------------
Pass it on
If you think it has merit! If not then just discard
it...
But if you discard this thought process,
Then don't you dare sit back and complain about
What bad shape this country is in!

[serialspell]

actually for me this is what i talk about all the time, control of individuals is getting out of hand and what is considered right and wrong now has totally changed

[Smash]

I received this in an email this morning, some may recognize it already. I thought it worthy for a read and thought I would post it. Normally I dont post this kind of stuff but it makes ALOT of sense!! Please read to the end!!

WOW, WHAT A WAKEUP

Dear God:
Why didn't you save the school children at ....
Blackburg, Virginia
Amish Country, PA
Cazenovia, Wisconsin
Columbine High School
Moses Lake, Washington 2/2/96
Bethel, Alaska 2/19/97
Pearl, Mississippi 10/1/97
West Paducah, Kentucky 12/1/97
Stamp, Arkansas 12/15/97
Jonesboro, Arkansas 3/24/98
Edinboro, Pennsylvania 4/24/98
Fayetteville, Tennessee 5/19/98
Springfield, Oregon 5/21/98
Richmond, Virginia 6/15/98
Littleton, Colorado 4/20/99
Taber, Alberta, Canada 5/28/99
Conyers, Georgia 5/20/99
Deming, New Mexico 11/19/99
Fort Gibson, Oklahoma 12/6/99
Santee, California 3/ 5/01 and
El Cajon, California 3/22/01?
Sincerely,
Concerned Student

-----------------------------------------------------

Reply:
Dear Concerned Student:
I am not allowed in schools.
Sincerely,
God

----------------------------------------------------------

How did this get started?...
-----------------
Let's see,
I think it started when Madeline Murray O'Hare
complained
She didn't want any prayer in our schools.
And we said, OK..
------------------
Then ,
Someone said you better not read the Bible in
school,
The Bible that says
"thou shalt! Not kill,
Thou shalt not steal,
And love your neighbors as yourself,"
And we said, OK...
-----------------
Dr. Benjamin Spock said
We shouldn't spank our children
When they misbehaved
Because their little personalities
Would be warped and we might damage their
self-esteem.
And we said,
An expert should know what he's talking about
So we won't spank them anymore..
------------------
Then someone said
Teachers and principals better not
Discipline our children when they misbehave.
And the school administrators said
No faculty member in this school
Better touch a student when they misbehave
Because we don't want any bad publicity,
And we surely don't want to be sued.
And we accepted their
reasoning...
------------------
Then someone said
let's let our daughters have abortions if they
want,
And they won't even have to tell their parents.
And we said, that's a grand idea...
------------------
Then some wise school board member said,
Since boys will be boys
And they're going to do it anyway,
let's give our sons all the condoms they want,
So they can have all the fun they desire,
And we won't have to tell their parents they got
them at school.
And we said, that's another great idea...
------------------
Then some of our top elected officials said
It doesn't matter what we do in private as long as
we do our jobs.
And we said,
It doesn't matter what anybody,
Including the President,
Does in private as long as we have jobs and the
economy is good....
------------------
And someone else took that appreciation a step
further
And published pictures of nude children
And then stepped further still by
Making them available on the
Internet.
And we said, everyone's entitled to free speech....
------------------
And the entertainment industry said,
let's make TV shows and movies that promote
Profanity, violence and illicit sex...
And let's record music that encourages
Rape, drugs, murder, suicide, and satanic themes...
And we said,
it's just entertainment
And it has no adverse effect
And nobody takes it seriously anyway,
So go right ahead.
------------------
Now we're asking ourselves
Why our children have no conscience,
! And why it doesn't bother them to
Kill strangers, classmates or even themselves.
------------------
Undoubtedly,
If we thought about it long and hard enough,
We could figure it out.
I'm sure it has a great deal to do with...
"WE REAP WHAT WE SOW,"
------------------
Pass it on
If you think it has merit! If not then just discard
it...
But if you discard this thought process,
Then don't you dare sit back and complain about
What bad shape this country is in!


Thanks for posting this Pumpkin!!!

[amclure]

So true so very very true.

[christine chittick]

Very true, thanks for posting!

[Mandi]

I didn't always believe in God, but after having my child, I can't believe that she is just some coincidence that started with a single cell that evolved into everything we have. I have a very strong faith, and although I don't believe religion should be shoved down anyone's throat, I think it should still be allowed in school. I had a nun for a grade 5 teacher, everymorning we had to sing O'Canada and recite the Lord's Prayer. I think that for those who want to pray in the mornings, they should be allowed to do so together. School teaches math, english, art, gym, science, lots of lovely things. But not one of those things is going to get you anywhere if you don't have good strong morals. Religion isn't the only way to instill morals, but I very firmly believe that there should be classes taught that teach people to respect themselves and each other. Not everything in the bible do I agree with, but certainly some of the comandments should be taken more seriously in everyones lives.

[rhiley_08j]

I'm surprised they haven't removed your thread, I don't think we are allowed to discuss spiritual matters on this site.

[notfarnow]

give me a break

poor oppressed christians, if only we had listened to you

[notfarnow]

It's probably because they stopped using full-floor urinals. Ever since they started installing wall-hung urinals, there have been far more school shootings. That's A FACT

[ceg]

I personally don't believe religion should be in schools. There are too many varying religions now. You can't just teach christians/catholics and not have the same thing available to all students of differing religions.

Religion should be taught at home or the place of worship for which ever religion.

[magoosmomma]

Thanks for posting Pumpkin.. I am surely going to pass that along

[baseball 23]

What a crock of %&*#! Really, we expect our educators to teach our kids morals? Maybe if the parents did their job a home it wouldn't be a problem. But no, we have to spread one person's view on religion to the masses to make everybody conform! Get real, teach you kids values at home, leave education to the educators.

[girdy]

What a crock of %&*#! Really, we expect our educators to teach our kids morals? Maybe if the parents did their job a home it wouldn't be a problem. But no, we have to spread one person's view on religion to the masses to make everybody conform! Get real, teach you kids values at home, leave education to the educators.

I agree. If there is a problem with the morals of our kids, it's because there is a problem with the morals of their parents. Considering mornings, evenings, weekends, school holidays, kids spend the largest part of their lives under the influence of their parents. It's far too simplistic to say that issues we have today are a domino result of school prayer being dropped.

[Mandi]

I agree. If there is a problem with the morals of our kids, it's because there is a problem with the morals of their parents. Considering mornings, evenings, weekends, school holidays, kids spend the largest part of their lives under the influence of their parents. It's far too simplistic to say that issues we have today are a domino result of school prayer being dropped.

I seriously doubt the problems are because of prayer being stopped. I have to whole heartedly agree that the problem lies in parenting and acceptable 'normalities' in today's society. My question however is how do we fix it? How do we stop what is wrong. Clearly there are bad role models in a lot of children's lives, but how do we set good ones? It's so easy to say it's bad parenting, and I relaly feel the same way. But if that is in fact the case, obviously you're not going to be able to reach the parents in a way you can make them change. Change has to start with children. I have a very very different set of values and morals than I was brought up to believe were acceptable, and I can thank one of myteachers for a lot of my beliefs.

[notfarnow]

I'm telling you, the problem is the urinals

In the good ole' days, the urinals went right down to the floor, you could pee straight down and the worst that would happen is you "mist" your shoes a bit.

With the short, wall-hung urinals you pee at a straighter angle, and end up getting sprayed back with the pee of a hundred men.

You put these things in schools, and people end up so disgruntled and jadded that they start shootin' people. Just look at the numbers, school shootings have gone up dramatically since they started putting wall-hung urinals in schools. Numbers don't lie, folks.

[sjchickie]

Although some of that poem applies....much of it does not. People need to realize canada is not primarily made up of white people anymore. With diversity comes different religions and beliefs so teaching it in school is TO CONFUSING. As for abortions and condoms. Your darn right girls dont need to tell their mothers, I am pro choice..what people do is there business. My friend gave up her baby for adoption and wanted to go in and talk to girls in district 8 about their choices and district 8 is still preaching abstinence. Kids are having sex regardless....kids are getting pregnant, and kids are being sexual. give them condoms and teach them a little theory us liberated people like to call "harm reduction". These kids are not going to listen either way. So as much as your poem meant well...i think its a little bit silly..stop blaming others and start teaching these things at HOME. Learning begins at home, stop blaming the school it is for education not religious purposes. Kids are giving each other oral sex IN SCHOOL you dont think it would make sense to equip high schoolers with condoms. HOPING our teen pregnancy rate MIGHT drop some. I am not even touching on the 150% increase in teenagers getting STD's in this province. CONDOMS people if we stopped telling our kids that no sex is the best way and started saying HEY wait till marriage BUT if you choose not to protect yourself so that you dont pass around AIDS?????

As someone going into the social work field..poems like this set us back generations. Its TO LATE to go back people...lets try and fix what we can at present. Sorry pumpkin but that is to far gone...we need to worry about what we can change!!!!

[jdcb]

I personally don't believe religion should be in schools. There are too many varying religions now. You can't just teach christians/catholics and not have the same thing available to all students of differing religions.


Thing is, you can discuss every religion BUT christianity. Try to talk about that and that's where the rule comes into play...

[jdcb]

But no, we have to spread one person's view on religion to the masses to make everybody conform!

Isn't that exactly what's happening by saying that it's inapprpriate to talk about?

[rhiley_08j]

I agree with both sides, I don't think that religion should be taught in schools. There is so much diversity who is to decide what religion is taught.

... I have to whole heartedly agree that the problem lies in parenting and acceptable 'normalities' in today's society. ...

At the same time I agree with Mandi, I think that the whole state of society can be blamed on "the normalities in today's society". Children are constantly bombarded with double standards in life. We teach them morals, and tell them to be good to others, and then we will let them entertain themselves with things that say the opposite of what we tell them, expecting them to distinguish between what we tell them and what they see.

[jdcb]

I have to whole heartedly agree that the problem lies in parenting and acceptable 'normalities' in today's society.

I think that is what the whole letter is about, these things being normal now...

[jdcb]

...I am pro choice..

Not that it's pertinant to the thread, but everybody is pro choice...

[rhiley_08j]

You know the if you look back in history and follow religion along the way to where we end up, it is easily discernable that religion is the cause of why society is the way it is today.

Religion today has clouded the Bible’s teachings. For generations, and generations, organized religion has altered and adapted what the Bible has to say, because the majority no longer agreed. It is because of this constant changing that has caused many to lose faith. There is no stability in organized religion. People are so misguided by religion that they begin to question everything the Bible has to say and lose faith in God. The one thing that religion is supposed to build on and it is the actual cause for people’s loss.

Many people associate the Bible’s teachings with the Christian religion, and over centuries the Christian religion has constantly gone wrong; performing some of the worst acts in human history. Christianity if it was truly following God’s teachings should have been focusing on love for centuries, which would have brought modern civilization to a much better outcome than the one we have today. Instead, generation after generation, after generation, have constantly ignored the Bible’s teachings, changed it to their liking, and led themselves into a downward spiral that is so prevalent today.

[notfarnow]

Thing is, you can discuss every religion BUT christianity. Try to talk about that and that's where the rule comes into play...

BS

[jdcb]

Sure it is NFN... Go talk about Wicka and the beliefs of African religions for hours, then after 45 minutes mention god once in class...

Rhiley, it's gonna sound wierd, but your kinda right. Way back when almost nobody of the masses was literate, so the only teachings they had was the interpretations of a few. And that kind of power can go to a persons head. That's why I like to pick up the book and read it myself...

[rhiley_08j]

My question however is how do we fix it? How do we stop what is wrong. Clearly there are bad role models in a lot of children's lives, but how do we set good ones?

This is not about religious beliefs, this is about emotion. It is about Love for one another. Whether a person believes in Jesus makes no difference on their emotion of Love. Who today, can honestly say that they love everyone? If everyone did truly feel love towards everyone, think of how much a difference that would make in the world today.

Imagine a world were no one judged anyone, but rather if a person erred people felt empathy for that person and gave them love and support to become a loving human being. Imagine that if you needed something, someone would give it to you because they love you, and you would do likewise. Imagine a world where you could be that way, and you wouldn’t be considered weird, or different, but would be the norm.

If the human civilization continues on the path it is going, it can only come to a negative end. It doesn’t matter what anyone believes regarding the end. All that matters is that humans have lead themselves and life as a whole to their own end. Many people think that this is a dooms-dayer attitude, just as many think that the idea of loving one another is hippie non-sense. However, this is neither. This is a realistic view of where things are going unless humans come together as a civilization.

Just as humans have been able to lead themselves into a society that is full of hatred, injustice, and lack of love; they can turn it around and follow love as their way of life. If love was the primary reason for life, than there would be no fear, there would be no hatred, no murder; people would pass each other and talk to each other. There would be no need for money because if you need something then somebody would give it to you. People would work because they knew that what they were doing was going to help someone else.

Slowly, if every person in the world developed an attitude of love towards others, than we could fix what’s wrong with society. It seems like such a simple solution, but yet there is another emotion that is just as strong as love that prevents a peaceful existence.

That emotion is Pride. A person will continue doing what’s wrong, for fear of admitting they were wrong. They will make excuses for their behavior in order to save their Pride. We all do it, each and every one of us. Pride has becomes such a strong emotion that it prevents Love. It’s hard to believe that an emotion that was supposed to create a happy, content feeling has become something so detrimental to society’s downfall.

[notfarnow]

Sure it is NFN... Go talk about Wicka and the beliefs of African religions for hours, then after 45 minutes mention god once in class...


Give me a break. You are just repeating lame stuff that everyone says.

The only thing that's not allowed in school is prayer directed by teachers or staff. Students are allowed to learn about different religions, including christianity, where it's pertinent to the curriculum.

[jdcb]

Then why was it when a friend of mine brought it up she was told to stop talking about it or face detention?

[notfarnow]

Who knows?

There is a time and place. Maybe your friend was interrupting a lecture about evolution, and insisted on trying to steer the conversation. I know that happened when I was in High school. No biggie, but there is a time and place for religion.

[rhiley_08j]

Who knows?

There is a time and place. Maybe your friend was interrupting a lecture about evolution, and insisted on trying to steer the conversation. I know that happened when I was in High school. No biggie, but there is a time and place for religion.


What about for those people that their whole life revolves around their religious teachings? Then the time and place would always be present. They never put God on the back burner and only bring him to the front when they need him. What about their right not to except evolution? Isn't that infringing on a person's right?

[notfarnow]

What about their right not to except evolution? Isn't that infringing on a person's right?

Yes, they also have the right not to accept mathematics or spelling. But they don't have the right to mandate curriculum.

[rhiley_08j]

Then who exercises that mandate? Who says what we can and cannot learn? Why?

[notfarnow]

Then who exercises that mandate? Who says what we can and cannot learn? Why?

When you decide to send your children to a public school, you relinquish control over the curriculum. You have a right to disagree, but you don't have a right to interfere

[rhiley_08j]

When you decide to send your children to a public school, you relinquish control over the curriculum. You have a right to disagree, but you don't have a right to interfere


So basically what you're saying is that we have no control over what our children learn. Than at the same time how can the blame be placed solely on parents, if we have no control over what they are learning?

[notfarnow]

So basically what you're saying is that we have no control over what our children learn. Than at the same time how can the blame be placed solely on parents, if we have no control over what they are learning?

If you disagree with the curriculum, you have every right to voice your concerns with the board of education. You can even go a step further and home-school your kids.

But no, you can't expect the public school system to adapt to individual religious perspectives.

[rhiley_08j]

If you disagree with the curriculum, you have every right to voice your concerns with the board of education. You can even go a step further and home-school your kids.

But no, you can't expect the public school system to adapt to individual religious perspectives.


But that's exactly what it's done, it has removed all religious practices from the school system in order to adapt to others views of it as being wrong. What's good for the goose, should be good for the gander.

[notfarnow]

But that's exactly what it's done, it has removed all religious practices from the school system in order to adapt to others views of it as being wrong. What's good for the goose, should be good for the gander.

No, it has adapted so that NO religion gets particular favor in the school system.

If there is a muslim student, do his female teachers have to wear a hajib? NO.

Is history or science curriculum based on teachings from the Koran? No.

Freedom of religion also includes freedome FROM religion.

[sjchickie]

I sense that the white christian population has some hostility on this issue. NFN is right...its BS....NO religions get taught in school and so they shouldnt be. We live in a SMALL city if you were to go to Toronto there is schools for christians, natives, blacks, and if you so choose you can send your child there. BUT you live in little old saint john, NB soooooo you need to suck it up or move on in regards to the religion thing. I would be pretty sour if they started teaching my 6-15 year old about religion without my permission so im glad they dont. Weather people like to think it or not this is about color...we arent repopulating this country so they are bringing in thousands of immigrants who practice a pluthora of different religions and beliefs? what do you all expect your making it sound like there are NO schools that teach religion. Your wrong!! they are all over canada....just not in NB

and as for pro-choice i was referring to abortion and not every one is pro-choice many are pro-life

[rhiley_08j]

No, it has adapted so that NO religion gets particular favor in the school system.

If there is a muslim student, do his female teachers have to wear a hajib? NO.

Is history or science curriculum based on teachings from the Koran? No.

Freedom of religion also includes freedome FROM religion.


OK based on what you are saying than anything and everything having to do with Christian religion or religion in general should be removed from the school? What about Easter, or Christmas? Does that mean that anything having to do with Christianity should be removed?

[notfarnow]

I dunno, maybe rhiley_08j thinks they should be teaching Islam and Buddhism in school. Is that what he's saying?

Or is he saying we shoudl only teach the religion of the majority, ie "the right" one?

[rhiley_08j]

I dunno, maybe rhiley_08j thinks they should be teaching Islam and Buddhism in school. Is that what he's saying?

Or is he saying we shoudl only teach the religion of the majority, ie "the right" one?


Who's to say what the right religion is? I think that every one should learn about different religions, and than based on what they learn make a decision that's right for them. I however, don't agree that it should be taught in school. At the same time I don't think that my children should be forced to accept evolution as fact. I believe that all credit for creation is due to our creator, and I don't think it is right that my kids come home being taught something different. But evolution is a whole different story and I am not even getting into that.

That is all that I meant. The thing is where do you draw the line?

[Goin4Coffee]

I'm shocked they unlocked this thread...
Im NOT making any opinion, just stating the fact that it "was" closed, but magically re-opened..

[notfarnow]

At the same time I don't think that my children should be forced to accept evolution as fact. I believe that all credit for creation is due to our creator, and I don't think it is right that my kids come home being taught something different. But evolution is a whole different story and I am not even getting into that.


I don't believe in evolution either.

I believe that the earth was created by a giant flying spaghetti monster. (http://www.venganza.org/)

Because of my beliefs, do I get to dictate what's taught in school? No, I don't. Neither do you.

Aneewayz, it's 4:42 on a friday... I have to go drink booze. It's been fun though!

[admin]

I'm shocked they unlocked this thread...
Im NOT making any opinion, just stating the fact that it "was" closed, but magically re-opened..

When it was hidden, other people complained :)

Similar to something Abe Lincoln said, "You can't please all of the people all of the time" :)

[jdcb]

and as for pro-choice i was referring to abortion and not every one is pro-choice many are pro-life

i know what you meant, but everyone is pro choice and pro life...

[Mandi]

i know what you meant, but everyone is pro choice and pro life...

I don't understand.

[jdcb]

I think Penn & Teller said it best, so I'll try to quote it:

"Everybody is Pro Life and Pro Choice, it's whether your for or against abortion that matters"

(I may have not got that right, and may have cut some profanity out of it)

[rhiley_08j]

I don't understand.


I get what he's saying, it depends on what end of the spectrum you're looking at. Every one is all for making your own choices and every one is all for living. Sort of an oxy moron.

[jdcb]

rhiley has it too, that's kinda what i mean when i say it...

rhiley and I are pretty close when it comes down to it on our opinions expressed in here I think, just wording it a little different...

[rhiley_08j]

It's funny that everyone started to go against the first thing in the poem, the bible in schools. What about beatings, or the strap, etc...?

[rhiley_08j]

rhiley has it too, that's kinda what i mean when i say it...

rhiley and I are pretty close when it comes down to it on our opinions expressed in here I think, just wording it a little different...


Don't say that, they might gang up on you, LOL:rofl:

[jdcb]

Don't say that, they might gang up on you, LOL:rofl:

yeah, like that doesnt' happen often... :)

[rhiley_08j]

I'm all for everybody, I just like a good debate. The wife tells me shhhh..... LOL

[jdcb]

I do too sometimes, wanna start a thread on gun control?

[jdcb]

or we could hijack this one

[rhiley_08j]

Well you know, we've seen where gun control has gotten the americans ... LOL

[jdcb]

I think when a person graduates from high school, should they wish they can apply for a hand gun. If this person can prove competency handling the weapon, can shoot within a certain range, and doesn't seem like a retard, should be issued one from the government... It's like what the americans and russia did, MAD (mutually assured destruction)...

Would you be more likely to rob a store that had no guns, or 2/3rds of the customers pack'n???

[rhiley_08j]

I see your point, but I'd rather see a world without guns at all.

[jdcb]

I see your point, but I'd rather see a world without guns at all.

I'd like to see Coca Cola with no sugar that actually tasted GOOD...

[richunclepennywise]

nice hijack



lol

[vanessalynn5484]

I was going to write something thoughtful then I got distracted by something shiny. I like shiny things. Looking at the lamps gives me a headache though:(

[vanessalynn5484]

Oh dear sweet drama....
just get your eyes closed and get some rest
cause you're gonna need it for what happens next
it's a never ending cycle and it's an attention game
and you've always got someone or something else to blame

I am not a demon or deity
I am not a Sheppard nor a sheep
I'm not a preacher nor a(?)
I am that thorn that keeps dig, diggin in your head

Atop a silver latter
well I got to the top
The latter started to quiver...
and I fell to the bottom.
*SourKeys

[serialspell]

I want a puppy, look what i can dohttp://www.iconburst.com/avatars/animated/841thtakethis.gif (http://www.iconburst.com/love-avatar-942.html)

[vanessalynn5484]

I was jumping on the bed with the tooth fairy and I fell off. I'm not hurt, but I'm STARTLED!


(where I got easter bunny I dunno)

[vanessalynn5484]

I just want to quickly state something about schools and religious education. I attended a Catholic school, owned by the Church. I also was enrolled in an enrichment team focused on teaching students about The Holocaust and what it meant to be Jewish. I learned all about the religion and it's history. I even won an award from the Jewish Historical Museum for a compilation of poetry based on Canada's Involvement (or lack there of) in the Holocaust. I became incredibly enlightened about a different faith through a Catholic School. It inspired me to learn about different cultures and religions.

[Pumpkin]

I would just like to clarify that when I posted this, I didn't have in mind that everything there was agreeable.

In no way did I post this to push religion on to anyone, and a lot had a good point bringing up diversity. I myself don't go to church or follow any specific religion. And although there is much diversity now, our children whatever race, color or religion etc, deserve to be raised right with good morals and values. They are in fact our future and maybe by letting things get way outta hand (ex: way to much sex and violence compared, lack of discipline, etc), we are causing a landslide for the future. Because whether we want to accept it or reject it, what we do today affects tomorrow! No matter how or what you look at.

I also in no way expect teachers or others to teach values and morals, or to discipline my or any other persons child or children. I agree 100% with who ever said it is up to the parents to instill this into their children. Ofcourse it is!! I believe that very very strongly. BUT, see I also beleive that sometimes it does become up to the teacher, care giver, ect to help teach a child to behave, ect. We do not always have them in our care when they are away at school or day care, ect. So, if I am working hard to teach my child good manners, politness, good values and morals at home and then they go to school just to have some lil snot nose kids who's parents don't give 2 cents about what their kid does or how it behaves, go and rub off their bad influences to my child. Then I have wasted my time! This is when it becomes necessary for a teacher or adult figure besides the parents to step in. Because we are not around, and their has to be rules set and followed!

Again, there are points I strongly agree with and areas I don't agree with. This wasn't posted to stir the pot or light a fire under anyone. Just was intesresting, seeing as ALL THESE THINGS ARE TRUE, it's just not everyone looks at it being good and not everyone looks at it as being bad, and then ofcourse not everyone will agree!

[dollydoo]

What a crock of %&*#! Really, we expect our educators to teach our kids morals? Maybe if the parents did their job a home it wouldn't be a problem. But no, we have to spread one person's view on religion to the masses to make everybody conform! Get real, teach you kids values at home, leave education to the educators.



I totally agree with you Baseball23

[G.R.U.]

Semi derailment of thread, and has nothing to do with the whole religion in school theme.

I just spent the last while reading this list of post. Few questions I have to ask, and hope they don't stir things up.

God and god, these are two differnt things but pervious post put them as inter changeable depending on the author of the post. Very confusing if you know the differnce.

Easter, is a christian holiday. However, Christmas is a collection of pagan festivials later merged by a Roman Empirer to in part ligitamize Chritianity. Saint Nick, is also a collection of differnt pro active Nice people that gave to the poor or the needed.

Now the statement people are going to get pissed off at me for.

I'm anti religious, rased in a single family by anglicans, catholics, bap's. Additionally expossed to other religions like judism, muslism faiths, wicka, and the list goes on. This began before I can remember due to the nature of my family and how they interacted in the world. An expection to the rule you could say. Oh i'm anti spiritual in regards to the norm also. I am not an athist (may have spelt that wrong), but I dont' believe in god. Just accept the statment don't try to hurt your brain by working around it.

My personal opinion is that at the least prior to mass free education. Those that believed in religion where and are nothing more the sheep. The prinicple behind this is individual will or the belief of such is a falsehood. Its or was controlled by mass fear, lack of education, and the establishment of guilt (this is perdonimately in the christian, jew's and muslim faiths) as i've noticed.

The requirement of religion or spirituality as these can be two differnt things are tools of those afraid. It is the fear that there is no guiding power out there controlling this world we live in. Even if they can see that control doesn't mean farness.

I however am freed of this opressive mind set. When I die, I die. I live I will live, not by the rules of a man or women wearing funky cloths saying hes give us the words of god(s) or God.

However before you place judgment on me. I must say that religion and spirituality I believe is the source of all evil. But the evil is that of corrupt peolpe at the top of the leadership of those religious organizations, not the organization it sell.

If I remember my forced christian teachings, God or was it jesus figuritivly said do not worship me in mass (mass being public). worship or paryer is a private matter between you and your god(s). The creation of religion is a tool of the greedy and wealthy to control others.

Todays yeasterdays religions fall to the way side, and the Religions of tommorrow (Microsoft, CocaCola and Toyota) rise from there ashes. We so love our capitialistic matericalistic impules.

We are danmed by our selves however we go.

I believe that no one here will agree with my opinion. But thats the curse of living in a conservative province.

LOL, funny thing is my a conservative, but still.

[Mandi]

The requirement of religion or spirituality as these can be two differnt things are tools of those afraid. It is the fear that there is no guiding power out there controlling this world we live in. Even if they can see that control doesn't mean farness.

I however am freed of this opressive mind set. When I die, I die. I live I will live, not by the rules of a man or women wearing funky cloths saying hes give us the words of god(s) or God.

However before you place judgment on me.


I am not afraid of death. There to me, is more uncertainty in life then there is in death. I was once a person who didn't believe. I didn't have to. I wanted not to believe that one thing was responsible for all existance. The idea of one person being the creator of everything, being the beginning and the end was horrifying. I will not judge you for your beliefs, but it seems you have already judged me. I believe, not because I fear, but because I feel.

[G.R.U.]

I'm sorry about how your taking it. As I tryed to Explain in the beging of my statment. This is a view of pervious centuries gone by. This is a historical view point I have. If you live in todays society, it is not my place to judge you.

[Nail]

Please don't try to walk away saying you didn't judge Christian Faith here. You did. Just because religions have been around longer then you can fathom doesnt mean they're outdated.

[icedragon]

Shiny is distracting

[mizunderstood]

Before I start I just want to say that I do not mean to be rude, or demean anyone elses opinion. This is just how I feel.. Please do not take it personal.. thank you
I guess I am the one that is on the fence here, I feel that religion should be allowed in "school" it does not have to be during school hours. I remember when I was in middle and high school a group of us met once or twice a week before class on the steps of the school or in the library and had a prayer, and a blessing and sometimes a little bible reading or question time. I feel that if you are determined to want ur children taugh "religion" in school then there is a school here that might be a good option.. I think that the rules to religion in schools need to be adjusted... Especially for those that are opposed to the evolution debate (for example).. Appeal to the school board and ask that your child be removed from that class that discusses it. It is allowed if u can prove that it is against ur relious beliefs and may cause harm to ur family structure.. I truly think that we should all be allowed to worship, pray, meditate or stand on our heads and spit nickles, whatever u want to do, as long as u do not force others to take part in it, do not condem people that do not conform to ur beliefs and as long as it does not threaten any one else.. etc.. I guess I just don't see what the problem is concering religion in school. But I don't think the original poster meant for this to turn into a religious debate. I think that pumpkin just wanted to highlight societies ignorance.. (Please understand the word before you comment on that one..) I don't mean to say that we are all ignorant, but I find in our time and society there is soo many double standards that we allow to continue.. You tell ur child that it is wrong to kill and rape, yet you buy your child a certain game that the whole goal is to rape and kill women (mostly) and do not explain the difference.. We have people of authority doing indecent things. *cough cough* Clinton...But they know what to say to make the "wrong" into a "right" Whether this debate ever will be settled I don't know ...morals, beliefs, and how we interpret the world and how we interact with those in it ultimetly based on how we are raised and taught at home.
When these acts of violence happen we need as parents to explain to our children that it is wrong, why and truly hope that we are doing the best thing we can do to prevent more atrocities.

[mizunderstood]

I too like shiny things... Hey look that dog has a puffy tail.. hehehehe

[baseball 23]

If evolution is part of the curriculum, and students are allowed to opt out of it, how will they be tested on the knowledge of the science?

[kate]

hi
i really do agree with SJCHICKIE. the very first post was very well, an i enjoyed reading it, But on the other side it is true with how much sex is going on in places you wouldnt think about. When i was in middle school i was told not to have sex an wait intil i found that mr.perfect. Honestly tho at the age of 13 or 14 i wasnt going to find the so called Mr.perfect. I went and did what i thoughted would be right and that was to have sex at a young age. I also do agree that there should be a class in high school to talk about this kind of stuff. Not just sex but dugs to. Now a days there is way to much of this an if you go to a mall there is many young teenage mothers i think this is kinda sad. Things happen tho. I just wish there was a way to drill it in everybody head that you need to use a condom. And there should be a class in middle school talking about what can happen if you dont use a condom. My family never told me stuff like this i learned it all from friends and school. I thinks parents should talk to there children about this.



Thanks for posting your post :D

[Mandi]

hi
i really do agree with SJCHICKIE. the very first post was very well, an i enjoyed reading it, But on the other side it is true with how much sex is going on in places you wouldnt think about. When i was in middle school i was told not to have sex an wait intil i found that mr.perfect. Honestly tho at the age of 13 or 14 i wasnt going to find the so called Mr.perfect. I went and did what i thoughted would be right and that was to have sex at a young age. I also do agree that there should be a class in high school to talk about this kind of stuff. Not just sex but dugs to. Now a days there is way to much of this an if you go to a mall there is many young teenage mothers i think this is kinda sad. Things happen tho. I just wish there was a way to drill it in everybody head that you need to use a condom. And there should be a class in middle school talking about what can happen if you dont use a condom. My family never told me stuff like this i learned it all from friends and school. I thinks parents should talk to there children about this.



Thanks for posting your post :D

When I was in middle school, we didn't have sex ed, the closest thing we had was one day someone came in, talked to us about puberty and how to use a pad. It was quite sad really, they weren't even that informative. we learned nothing about the opposite sex, as they had to leave the room, and be spoken to seperately and vice versa. Abstinance this day and age is not something that happens often, it's actually far less common for someone to be abstinate then it is for them to have slept with like 5 people. It's sad, but by drilling it into children's head that it's not something they should talk about or do, it's going to make them curious. There needs to be more awareness about how to be safe. My mother always stressed safe sex, said it does feel good, but it's something you should be responsible with, and I hadn't had the 'urge' to defy my parents in this are until I was with someone for a substantial amount of time.