Wow! Did I hear right?

[Doug James]

I was watching CTV News this evening. They had a report (hardly!) on the Mayor's State of the City address today. Being a Saint John story and being on the local CTV station, which is now Nova Scotia centric -- I wasn't surprised that it was short on details. Or was it that there really wasn't much to report? The one thing I did hear and which stands out in my mind, is Storm-Away-Norm's reference to all the Help Wanted ads in store windows, citing it as an example of economic progress and a city that is moving forward.

I was going to wait until tomorrow morning to do a thorough analysis of the address -- assuming of course that the Telegraph-Journal provides more details than the TV reporter. But, quite frankly, I am so astounded by Norm's enthusiasm over minimum-wage service jobs that I just couldn't wait. So, let's see.

If a person gets one of these jobs and actually works 40 hours a week (doubtful) at minimum wage, they will earn a whopping $290 per week, so let's say $1250 per month. After deductions it'll drop to at least $1200, a nice round figure to look forward to in doing up their household budget.

Now, let's subtract $525 for rent (heat included), $30 for utilities, $200 for a car payment and another $60 for car insurance. Don't forget gas. The price varies but let's say they don't travel all that far so $100 should do it. What have I forgotten? Oh, yes, groceries. Just an estimate for a single Mom and 2 children...let's say $250 a month? Clothes....oops there's just $45 left. Shame, all those new malls and shiny stores and no opportunity to buy anything.

So there goes one person's monthly paycheque. Nothing much for clothes or personal toiletries or the occasional movie or book. Nothing to save for a rainy day, let alone retirement. But, God are they ever so fortunate to be part of Saint John's economic boom, right Norm?

I wouldn't think that too many average Joe's could get time off work on a Wednesday morning to squeeze into the Red Chamber to hear the Mayor's words directly. Were they even invited? But why wasn't the address posted on the City Hall website? That's called 'modern communications', a quick and simple way to disseminate information to the citizens at large. Ho Hum. Maybe tomorrow or the next day. Maybe never. I guess the Communications Manager is to0 busy managing the press right now -- a new role she has been forced to take on since the Totten kafuffle. Not informing the citizens of Saint John in a timely fashion is totally inexcusable and a further example of why a shake-up is desperately needed at City Hall.

I'm not sure what the Communications Manager is paid but it must be sustantial given the $90,000 that the Tourism Manager gets. By the way, that's 600 per cent more than what the poor service worker gets in a year and, for sure, she won't be receiving generous benefits that include unlimited sick leave.

That's it for now. Hopefully, there will be something with more substance in the TJ's report tomorrow. Otherwise, I'd have to say, the state of this city is certainly not something to be proud of.

Doug James

[jillalex1911]

Isn't that the truth, how about bringing some higher grossing jobs to the city, where people can actually make a living instead of living pay check to pay check, or in most peoples cases living in the red. There are alot of highly trained people working in lower paying jobs around this city because there is no work around here, and do this instead of leaving their homes, families and friends for western money.

[Cherry Pop]

I'd like to see all these help wanted signs. The only one I've seen lately is the one at the Dollarama west and I was shocked as I think that's the first time I've actually seen a sign posted in a window in a long time. Yeah minimum-wage jobs just give a tiny and I do mean tiny more money than when your on income assitance. I believe that many people who are working are just as poor as those on income assistance!

[Mandi]

90 000 a year ?! for the tourism manager? woooooooow... What is the budget to fix roads in saint john per annum? I was going to comment on the rest, but that last part there is a kick in the face.

[orange]

A lot of people complain about what politicians make, but they actually don't make much considering the job they do.

I mean in SJ, I think the mayor only gets about $35,000. For a city the size of SJ, I think that's pretty low :S

And councillors only get $1000 per month.

Sure, people can say that "they should do it because they want to make a contribution"... but when you can make more working in a call centre than you can as mayor, and even the mayor has bills to pay, it certainly limits who is willing to run for mayor.

Similarly, government workers don't really make a huge amount considering the job they do... executives are generally well educated, and if they were doing the equivalent job in the private sector, they would probably make a lot more... maybe even twice as much sometimes.

For a tourism manager, yeah, I don't know if the salary should be that high, considering the cost of living in SJ is so low. But on the other hand, if a good tourism manager can bring in more tourism for the city, then the city will easily benefit and recoup the extra salary cost.

[The_Dave]

State of the city address. I heard this on the radio this morning and almost fell on the floor laughing. What a joke. State of the city address. hahahahahahahahahaha

As for those jobs that jamesdk is talking about. I understand that it might be minimum wage but I would rather see someone take one of these jobs than go on welfare and be a tax burden to us. Everyone has to start somewhere to be self sufficient. Not everyone can start at the top. Not to mention building your own self esteem by bringing in your own money by EARNING it.

[karen]

As orange had stated "I mean in SJ, I think the mayor only gets about $35,000. For a city the size of SJ, I think that's pretty low :S

And councillors only get $1000 per month."
That's only for a part-time job (their positions are not considered full-time)! They also get paid for each meeting they attend, the committees/commissions they sit on, travel allowances, social functions they attend, etc... There are lots of perks/benefits that they receive that compensate for the income.

[orange]

As orange had stated "I mean in SJ, I think the mayor only gets about $35,000. For a city the size of SJ, I think that's pretty low :S

And councillors only get $1000 per month."
That's only for a part-time job (their positions are not considered full-time)! They also get paid for each meeting they attend, the committees/commissions they sit on, travel allowances, social functions they attend, etc... There are lots of perks/benefits that they receive that compensate for the income.

Yeah, but let's say they spend about 3 hours per day on council work... that's about 1000 hours per year. So for $12,000 per year, that's just $12 per hour -- for people who are guiding our city :rolleyes:

The mayor's salary though is easily too low for the importance of the job

[Mandi]

Yeah, but let's say they spend about 3 hours per day on council work... that's about 1000 hours per year. So for $12,000 per year, that's just $12 per hour -- for people who are guiding our city :rolleyes:

The mayor's salary though is easily too low for the importance of the job

It's a part time job. City councelers aren't supposed to consider it a full time job. I'd say it's pretty damn good salary, because how many do you think spend 3 hours EVERY day on council work?

[chevygirl]

Really though...Why???? Why work making min wage and be away from your family. When you can make MORE money sitting at home . Who cares where the money comes from when you are on assistance. I wouldn't !!! Sure I may care when I am working hard and not raken in any benifits from it . But if I had the option to go on assistance and make enough money to support my family without all the extra's. I would take that over a slum paying job that pays min wage. Frig that . It cost to go to work . So being paid min wage is almost worse because you have to pay for gas,car,sitter ect. Then your left with the same amount as someone on assistance. The only difference is working you get to spend very little time with the children.
I will say this . I am a hard worker and I do this to provide for my child. But if I was on min wage you can rest assure that I would be providing for him best if I were home all the time. Not leaving him everyday to work my tush off for nothing. Ever notice to that the harder the job the less you get paid . What is with that?

[skallywag]

OK, I have to say something, and I know it's not going to be popular...but here goes.

Instead of "waiting" for a high paying job to come to you, why not get out there, get an education, and go "find" that job? If that job is not there, create it. Still no luck....MOVE. If "you" want to improve your quality of life, then "you" have to do something about it and not rely on (or blame) someone else.

Sometimes it's not easy landing that perfect job, and therein lies the problem. A lot of folks in SJ just don't want to do anything unless it is "easy."

[orange]

OK, I have to say something, and I know it's not going to be popular...but here goes.

Instead of "waiting" for a high paying job to come to you, why not get out there, get an education, and go "find" that job? If that job is not there, create it. Still no luck....MOVE. If "you" want to improve your quality of life, then "you" have to do something about it and not rely on (or blame) someone else.

Sometimes it's not easy landing that perfect job, and therein lies the problem. A lot of folks in SJ just don't want to do anything unless it is "easy."

I totally agree

With all the scholarships available to students from low-income backgrounds, working hard in grade school can be a ticket to future success.

But I read somewhere recently that because their parents don't put high expectations on those kids, the kids themselves maybe don't try as hard in school.

I think parents need to expect more out of their kids...

[orange]

I totally agree

With all the scholarships available to students from low income backgrounds, working hard in grade school can be a ticket to future success.

But I read somewhere recently that because their parents don't put high expectations on those kids, the kids themselves maybe don't try as hard in school.

Ah, here is the article:
http://www.cbc.ca/consumer/story/2007/02/08/university-enrollment.html

"Students from poorer families are less likely to enrol in university than children of wealthy families because of different parental expectations and weaker grades, suggests a new study released Thursday by Statistics Canada."

[care1978]

I was watching CTV News this evening. They had a report (hardly!) on the Mayor's State of the City address today. Being a Saint John story and being on the local CTV station, which is now Nova Scotia centric -- I wasn't surprised that it was short on details. Or was it that there really wasn't much to report? The one thing I did hear and which stands out in my mind, is Storm-Away-Norm's reference to all the Help Wanted ads in store windows, citing it as an example of economic progress and a city that is moving forward.

I was going to wait until tomorrow morning to do a thorough analysis of the address -- assuming of course that the Telegraph-Journal provides more details than the TV reporter. But, quite frankly, I am so astounded by Norm's enthusiasm over minimum-wage service jobs that I just couldn't wait. So, let's see.

If a person gets one of these jobs and actually works 40 hours a week (doubtful) at minimum wage, they will earn a whopping $290 per week, so let's say $1250 per month. After deductions it'll drop to at least $1200, a nice round figure to look forward to in doing up their household budget.

Now, let's subtract $525 for rent (heat included), $30 for utilities, $200 for a car payment and another $60 for car insurance. Don't forget gas. The price varies but let's say they don't travel all that far so $100 should do it. What have I forgotten? Oh, yes, groceries. Just an estimate for a single Mom and 2 children...let's say $250 a month? Clothes....oops there's just $45 left. Shame, all those new malls and shiny stores and no opportunity to buy anything.

So there goes one person's monthly paycheque. Nothing much for clothes or personal toiletries or the occasional movie or book. Nothing to save for a rainy day, let alone retirement. But, God are they ever so fortunate to be part of Saint John's economic boom, right Norm?

I wouldn't think that too many average Joe's could get time off work on a Wednesday morning to squeeze into the Red Chamber to hear the Mayor's words directly. Were they even invited? But why wasn't the address posted on the City Hall website? That's called 'modern communications', a quick and simple way to disseminate information to the citizens at large. Ho Hum. Maybe tomorrow or the next day. Maybe never. I guess the Communications Manager is to0 busy managing the press right now -- a new role she has been forced to take on since the Totten kafuffle. Not informing the citizens of Saint John in a timely fashion is totally inexcusable and a further example of why a shake-up is desperately needed at City Hall.

I'm not sure what the Communications Manager is paid but it must be sustantial given the $90,000 that the Tourism Manager gets. By the way, that's 600 per cent more than what the poor service worker gets in a year and, for sure, she won't be receiving generous benefits that include unlimited sick leave.

That's it for now. Hopefully, there will be something with more substance in the TJ's report tomorrow. Otherwise, I'd have to say, the state of this city is certainly not something to be proud of.

Doug James
WOOHOO! finally someone that thinks exactly the same way i do! ( not to say the rest of you dont) :)

[Doug James]

I believe that one of the reasons the politicians in Saint John are unable or unwilling to do more is precisely because the positions are part-time. If we had a full-time Mayor and full-time councillors (preferably in a ward system of government), they could, presumably, do far more.

Our politicians have, understandably, been afraid to increase their salaries for fear of a public backlash but I believe this has done more harm than good. Having said this, if I were Mayor I would treat it as a full-time position, take a 10 per cent pay cut for the first term and see what could be done about trimming management salaries which are far too extravagent for a city where one quarter of the people live in poverty.

Before adjourning in advance of next year's elections, I would advise Council to consider establishing an independent citizens committee to look into the pros and cons of a ward system of government and the salaries paid to elected representatives. The new council could then act on its recommendations.

[The_Dave]

I do not care what ELECTED level of government you are in, federal, provincial or municipal, you work hardly any hours, have summers off, have Christmas holidays off, have your regular vacation off, don't have to go to all the meetings, get fed at these meetings, if they are out of town say Fredericton or Ottawa, your hotel and expenses are paid for, have paid sick days, have a spending account on top of your regular salary, in most cases have another job besides being an elected official, sit on other group committees and get paid for attending (or not) those meetings, plus the perks from those meetings like food and mileage. Oh yeah, not to mention the side deals they work out with corporations and companies to hire their relatives and get perks from. Yeah these elected officials of ours have it rough. I think if you are going to get into politics because "YOU CARE" than your first 2 to 3 years should be on your dime (no pay from taxpayers) Let Us taxpayers see how and what you do to better the community you represent. Then we will decide if we want you back. Boy would you ever see the politician work hard those first few years, and who knows, they may just keep on working hard for that community and the tax payers. (DREAM ON)


WOOO wait a minute Dave, you are in a dream world. Oh well, everyone has a dream. Who would have thought it would be ruined by crooked politicians year after year after decade after dacade. Well you get the picture.

[orange]

I do not care what ELECTED level of government you are in, federal, provincial or municipal, you work hardly any hours,

That's absurd.

Federal politicians especially work hard. It's basically a 24/7 job, because you're representing about 60,000 people, and among those people, there will always be complainers who are overly demanding and asking for one thing or another, relating to local issues or problems people are having dealing with the government.

If you think they have such a sweet job Dave, you should go for it yourself :biggrin:

I wouldn't want their job even if it paid twice as much... dealing with people complaining about you all the time for unfounded reasons, getting made fun of in the press, etc.

[Cherry Pop]

Sorry but I agree with the dave on this one!

[The_Dave]

Dream on orange, dream on. I am not trying to offend you, even though the old Dave would (sorry puppyluv) I am 43 and I have seen the abuse. 24/7 thats a joke. Read my post again and you will realize what hours a politician actually works. If you don't believe me, look up their sittings schedules in the level of government they work. ( it is all public information ) You will see THE TRUTH. ( Again sorry puppyluv that name best describes my point )

[The_Dave]

Also orange my Mom said I should have been a politician ( God Bless Her ) but I would have been dropped or kicked out of the party that I represented because I speak up. I do not sit back and see something that is wrong and not say anything because I am towing the party line and scared to lose my seat or perks. I would say that is wrong, ( because I am supposed to be representing people like you and me, not the party line ) but where would that get me??? Kicked out of the party I was in. Orange, politics is an old boys club ( no discrimination intended ) and it will never change until US people get together and say, THAT IS ENOUGH, but good luck on that. The west wants to separate and Quebec wants to separate. Who do you think gets most of our tax dollars??? Quebec and Ontario!! Why would they change things?? Also now that the price of oil is soooooooooo high, it is now feasible to mine or refine the oil out of the tar sands, they also do not need us. Sorry orange but POLITICIANS = CORRUPTION. Power corrupts, has for centuries.

[frylock]

I don't think we should discount the work politicians do... even when the House is not in session, MPs are constantly working.

Even on this site, sometimes people will post about how they are having a problem with something related to the government... and others will suggest "call your MP", even when the issue isn't his fault at all. The people will expect the MP to push on their behalf, and that's what he/she will do.

Cabinet Ministers have an even tougher job, because they have to stay on top of their file and make decisions on policies.

I'm quite sure that the average MP works at least 12 hours per day, and essentially is on call for the other 12 hours in case of emergency.


To anyone who thinks an MP has it easy, check out these pages, describing "A day in the life of an MP":

http://www.markholland.ca/reports/dayottawa.htm
(a Liberal)

http://www.colinmayes.ca/EN/5261/49926
(a Conservative)

They have grueling schedules :)

[The_Dave]

Come on frylock, I am sure you have more brains than that. Who in the heck do you think made these websites. My god, you cannot be that Daft.

PS if you think they do sooooooooo much can you pay my taxes to without complaining.

No offense intended but come on!! Really?

[Watch it. Don't attack other members and don't use special characters to bypass the word filter]

[karen]

OK, I have to say something, and I know it's not going to be popular...but here goes.

Instead of "waiting" for a high paying job to come to you, why not get out there, get an education, and go "find" that job? If that job is not there, create it. Still no luck....MOVE. If "you" want to improve your quality of life, then "you" have to do something about it and not rely on (or blame) someone else.

Sometimes it's not easy landing that perfect job, and therein lies the problem. A lot of folks in SJ just don't want to do anything unless it is "easy."

very well said !

[Mandi]

Come on frylock, I am sure you have more brains than that. Who in the heck do you think made these websites. My god, you cannot be that Daft.

PS if you think they do sooooooooo much can you pay my taxes to without complaining.

No offense intended but come on!! Really?

[Watch it. Don't attack other members and don't use special characters to bypass the word filter]

Were you maybe a little drunk when you wrote that? lol little too much moose juice?

[skallywag]

Dave....did you vote in the last municipal election?

[The_Dave]

I ALWAYS vote, it is the ONE true freedom we have in this country.

Mandi, moose juice, yes, too much, never,